Remember times when there were no launcher? Just double click and you're running the game. Good times indeed.
Steam was considered an abomination when it was released. Drm and a launcher to run HL2? GTFO.
Yet here we are where everyone loves Steam. Its no surprise other companies wanted to follow knowing that in 20 years, a horrible consumer policy could become beloved.
When it was released? Steam ran like shit for me until probably 2017. It's finally a usable piece of software.
I also prefer steam because steam comes with a lot of benefits. If steam was still just a launcher and nothing more, I think most people would take issue with it today. That's just not the case, though.
Easy way to manage games, huge sales, support forums, easy way to manage friends, steam workshop, support for pretty much every controller, fast download servers
And one thing that people probably don't realize, is that steam will work with developers to implement patches. Many times when I play old games I'll go to PC gaming wiki and see that I need a few patches and mods to make the game work, but the wiki will say that those patches and mods were implemented into the steam release. It's really nice.
Interesting. I've only had Steam since 2017 but currently it's the slowest it's ever been.
It takes 20s to start and 5s to shut down on fast hardware. This is 6x slower than the electron-based open source Heroic launcher. It's also 20x slower than opening a web browser, considerably slower than opening Word, LibreOffice, unmodded Factorio, Kdenlive (a full-featured video editor), Cities Skylines 2 (known for poor optimization lol), or even the 11GB Quartus Prime (used for programming FPGAs) It's not far off from Windows itself.
The only apps slower to open than Steam are large games, some pro-level software, and the absolutely horrific MS Teams desktop app and Epic Games Store.
It takes 20s to start and 5s to shut down on fast hardware.
I just timed mine. Less than 7 seconds to start up, less than 1 second to shut down.
My PC is fast, but nothing amazing. CPU is i7-8700K, 16GB DDR4 RAM, and a gen 4 nvme limited to gen 3 speeds.
Weird. I have a Ryzen 9 5900HX (about Ryzen 7 3700 performance), Radeon RX6800M (15% slower than RX6700XT), 32GB DDR4 RAM, and a 2TB 970 Evo Plus SSD, which is 40% filled right now.
I know a lot of the recent increase in the launch and shut down time of Steam has to do with this stupid splash screen. It waits for the network for about 8s even though I have good Internet, and takes a long time to do other stuff as well.
I wonder what you played because it's the complete opposite for me, I got fed up with steam and old games so I started buying old ones exclusively on GoG because they do come with community patches.
Unless you've been dealing with steam VR which still has a long way to go before anyone calls it "easy". Not that the blame lies on Steam for rapidly changing hardware and standards but it seems like at some point they just gave up on consistency and served ui soup.
Steam vr has been simple for me, with multiple ways to launch into vr. Either launch the specific game I want to play first in VR mode, or justaunch steam vr and select the game from inside the VR room.
Do you even use steam? There is reason why its so loved. Everything else they bring is good enough price for me for steam being a launcher and drm.
Only problem I have with steam is worrying what will happen if valve goes bad or disappears in the future. But I hope it has sunk in to them by now that they will get much more money by being customer friendly and nice instead of being pieces of shit like some of the competition. I still hope that gog will become good competitor to steam.
Steam will stop working in Windows 7 from the 1st of January.
So decades of games that run perfectly fine on older computers (some lauched as little ago as a couple of years) will stop working if you got them on Steam.
Meanwhile in GOG you can get offline installers which will keep on working forever and ever in the hardware and software the game is compatible with.
Have Steam = be forced periodically to update your computer to keep on playing something you've had for ages. (Mind you, the workaround is to use Linux to play steam games, but people should not be forced to install it and deal with it just to play games from the previous generation - which are still fine as games go, since the gameplay is great and the additional eyecandy for more recent hardware does little to improve gameplaying fun - and in fact are not forced to if they got the games from GOG).
You most definitelly traded something quite big for the moderate convenience from Steam, it's just that you pay it in a delayed way and think "this is great" all the way till then.
There are many hills to die on about what is wrong with the world and I dont think steam is among the first one should choose imo. But yea, there are things that could be better with steam even if I personally havent had problem with it. Its just that valve not being just as shitty as other corporations seems to be the best we can hope for. I rather have them than nothing or something worse.
Over three decades of gaming and almost as much of software engineering means I'm pretty weary of things with unecessary dependencies on an external 3rd party, because they're bound to stop working when that external 3rd party decides to stop supporting it and/or goes bankrupt.
In my experience this is not a "might happen" thing, it's an "it always happens" one.
(This was actually a well discussed subject around Steam back in the day when it first came out: all games with DRM that depend on a server on the Internet maintained by a 3rd party will sooner or later stop working when that company doesn't feel like supporting it anymore, and this is inherent to that DRM architecture rather than Steam specific)
I would hardly call "dying on a hill" to prefer to not be dependent on some external company's mid-level manager's decisions about what's "outdated" for stuff I would like or need to keep on working.
That is true. I shall try to keep your point in mind actually, I should add this to the list of things i need to consider about backing stuff up and preserving things I can that might disappear.
So far it's just a warning from Steam that it will happen on the 1st of January 2024, and it's definitelly not an issue with Windows: Valve is chosing that the Steam launcher will not be supported in a specific Windows version anymore, and because most games bought via Steam check with Steam on startup in order to start - even when that's not at all required by the game itself - it might mean (depending of how they do it) that games will simply refuse to start even though the game itself was and still is 100% compatible with that version of Windows.
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Will they stop working, or will the launcher stop working? I haven't tried all my titles, but I know many of my older games launch fine without Steam kicking them off.
I am waiting to see what happens, since we're not yet at the 1st of January (it's for 2024, not 2023 - sorry for forgetting to point it out)
This is about games that check with Steam when they start to see if you're authorized to launch them, even though it's not the game itself that needs anything from Steam, and Steam is just the DRM layer.
Steam says they will stop supporting the Steam Launcher for Windows 7, so does that mean only the application frontend stuff (the store, downloading of games you bought and so on) or does it also include the components used by games with Steam as DRM to check if you're authorized to run them?
I suspect it's the latter (since Windows 7 is now all of 5% or so of the installed base and the legislation about digital purchases is crap so they're not forced to refund your for removing your access to the games you bought, so they could get away with it), but hope it's only the former.
It would be hilarious (in a near insane wierdly laughing kind of way) if I had to use a pirate hacked steam DLL to play my own games from Steam.
On a functional level, I think the obsession with ownership is overrated. If you collect physical media, for the sake of collecting, sure. On steam though, we all know you're lying if you say you've played half the shit in your library. Maybe a quarter to any meaningful level.
That being said, I love watching the people who think they're going to have some claim to a mass refund if it did shut down.
I'd say i have 1/4 unplayed games, maybe little less because I have many games that I played before steam started tracking gametime. But most of those are from family share anyway. I find it insane how some people just buy games and never even install them.
And I know there is no way I would be getting anything back if steam suddenly shut down, you are effectively buying a licence to play anyway instead of full ownership. But this is the world we have to put up with and steam is the least shit thing about how game industry works nowdays. Without steam I effectively just couldnt play games by now, which is also kind of troubling. Though if steam never existed and there had been nothing like it, managing all the games would have been nightmare even if you ignore updating them.
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https://www.reddit.com/gallery/155tkw0
Takes from gamers never change. They're always, consistently, horrible meme-takes.
It still will launch a launcher if it needs to, but at least you can see all of your games in one place
Which is absolutely a must if you have a huge library across multiple platforms. How else will I find out if that indie gem in the latest Humble Bundle is already in the library somewhere?
Joking aside, Playnite is especially awesome if you like admiring a collection in gallery view. The "sorting title" feature is exactly what we need in a day and age where publishers don't give a fuck about proper naming schemes.
They be like:
- Game
- Game II - Electric Boogaloo
- Game 3: Definition of Insanity
- Game™, the Return of Shenanigans
- Game V; "Definitely the Last One"™
I just want my collection displayed in the proper order, stop that shit!
Ah yes, DOOM... Which is not DOOM IV, because that was a separate project that has been cancelled.
[sad demonic noises]
Playnite is sick. I’ve spent a ton of hours writing my own themes to customize it and set up categories for all of my games. And by that point I don’t even want to play the game I opened it for anymore lol
Heroic is pretty good too. Supports a lot fewer stores than Playnite (only Epic, GOG, and Amazon at the moment), but it doesn't require any of the original launcher to be installed in order to download and play any games (with a few exceptions, such the the Star Wars games on Epic which still require the original launcher due to some fuckery).
Works on Windows, Linux, and Mac, and on the latter two, will even help you set up and configure Wine automatically in order to run your Windows games.
I made an Epic account years ago for the freebies. I'm not sure, but I'd bet I never played a single one.
If you claimed all of them you've got some seriously great games in there... Control, Subnautica, Alien Isolation, all the Tomb Raider games, Evil Within...
The entire BioShock collection, Rogue Legacy, Pathfinder Kingmaker, XCOM 2, Yooka-Laylee and Y-L and the Impossible Lair, Several Warhammer games, Turnip Boy Commits Tax Evasion, Tiny Tina's Assault on Dragon Keep, Star Wars Squadrons, Bridge Constructor: The Walking Dead, Fallout 1, 2, 3, NV, and Tactics, Guacamelee and Guacamelee 2, Homeworld 1&2 Remastered, KSP, and of course LAWN MOWING SIMULATOR!!!
Edit: I almost forgot PC Building Simulator with the IT Expansion!
I don't have Sims 2, I have Sims 4, but I may have missed Sims 2. My old computer couldn't open the epic games launcher, so I missed the first six or eight months of games.
I don't have Civ6, but they did give us Cities Skylines, and Europa Universalis IV
Four games that by themselves can use more of your free time than you will have for the rest of your life...
I'd rather pay to not use that godawful platform. Yes I know that's stupid in certain ways but my hate for Tim Swiney is simply that strong
There are ways to skip their launcher entirely amd use alternatives. Legendary and heroic launcher for example on Linux, there are probably some on windows as well.
I'm still not referring to DRM. I'm saying Epic is a shitty platform that I hate enough to pay money to avoid. Get some reading comprehension. Further, you're not even entirely correct.
Man, if you hate him so much you should take the freebies that they pay money for and not buy anything from the platform.
Same. I even played some of them. Still never gave them a red cent because their launcher is an offense to all mankind.
Their launcher is perfectly acceptable and even requires less inputs to launch games than Steam as the games you've installed are listed in the menu on the left that's always visible. Steam has become a mess that's full of bloat and useless features that only exist to profit from whales and gambling addicts.
Dont buy games from AAA publishers and you mostly have steam or GOG.
Better yet. Buy them from Itch.io directly, since indies are better anyway.
You don't even need one for GOG - GOG Galaxy is totally optional and you can download absolutelly run of the mill offline installers for all games on GOG which do not require the installer or any network access, and you even keep the forever and ever (so all your old games are still installable and run on an old gaming computer with the old OS, so long as the hardware hasn't died).
Hot take. Steam sucks. I would rather have 10 launchers than deal with Steam's mismanagement of game resources and hijacking my peripherals.
Oh and there is no financial advantage to it. They can track and use your gaming info and sell it. Just like Netflix.
So what you're saying is... you want EA to be the dominant force and directional pioneer in PC gaming.
Do you also masturbate to pictures of the Comcast logo?
That's a leap. EA sucks. There are plenty of games out there and there are plenty ways of managing them better than steam. Especially if you know your way around a PC.
It'd be another big player, it's not going to be some indie startup that suddenly breaks out into the light to dazzle everyone. And all the other players in this space have their own, worse, storefront and launchers...
Just imagine uplay, but with steam/valves loyal userbase and therefore everyone else sold their games on it. shudders
I mean, who cares? Like having 15 launchers is not a real thing for most gamers I know. It's saved in a cloud server under your profile. Just uninstall after you're done with a game.
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I can second the hijacking thing. Steam has its own controller input driver (?) it installs which sometimes clash with the actual drivers for the controller, which can lead to games registering input twice or not at all etc.
You can disable it but sometimes it randomly seems to re-enable itself and it's super annoying.
On the other hand though, Steam Input is really powerful for remapping inputs and setting up controller maps to use for keyboard and mouse games. I've never had trouble with it apart from with an old handheld PC that registers its built in controller as an Xbox 360 controller instead of Xbox One
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That's totally fine but it should be opt in, or just prompt you when you launch the game for the first time. It doesn't ask and then actively breaks things for some users.
Yeah it could definitely be more interactive, but then it would annoy users for the entirely opposite problem. I can see the complaints now in my head: "Steam prompts me about Steam Input before every single game I play! I get it valve" or similar (you and I both know the person would be ignoring some "don't remind me" option
The curseforge launcher is the worst launcher I've ever used. Best launcher imo is PolyMC, it's a fork of MultiMC that adds a bunch of really nice features like being able to download mods directly from the launcher.
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PolyMC now is PrismLauncher
The original team was kicked off the Github Repo and made a new Fork the called PrismLauncher
It was quite the Drama
This is a rare console W over PC. All your games are just there. No additional launchers or log ins, no waiting 30 minutes for the game to update because you havnt opened that launcher in months.
They're capable of supporting mouse and keyboard. For some reason most games just don't. Like on my PS5, anything that uses a mouse style menu, I can use a mouse to operate. I can also use a keyboard to type in input boxes with anything. But the only game I can fully play with a M&KB I've tried so far is Call of Duty. Which is nuts because Stellaris, Civilization and City Skylines are on this system, too, and they would very much benefit from full M&KB support.
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I don’t have a PS5, but I have a couple Dualsense controllers. Some games BLOW ME AWAY on controller. Returnal with haptics and adaptive triggers? INSANE. I wouldn’t play it with any other control method.
Yeah that's the point. On consoles they do, on PC they might not if you havnt opened the launcher in a while.
Can't exactly turn off the updater on an console /i.e. the software responsible for launching them games
I really wish tho that steam or similar could update in connected Standby/modern Standby on lowest priority
Best I can do is wake your laptop in your messenger bag, update, catch fire and burn your house down while you sleep.
Take it or leave it.
The whole heckin console is your launcher. So now you need another whole box IRL for the other launchers. Be sure to fiddle with your TV's source selection button that for some reason can never work the way we expect.
Not really how that works, but I get some people have a pathological need to shit on consoles for no reason.
That's exactly how that works, but some people have a pathological need to defend their buyer's remorse.
No it's not, different hardware isn't equivalent to different launchers. Because if it was you could say the same exact thing about PCs.
The point is, on console whether you play a ubisoft game or EA game or Microsoft game, they all are launched from the same native launcher.
And I literally don't even own a modern console and play all my games on PC, so have no buyers remorse. So please stop with this infantile platform war bullshit. I'm assuming you're a grown-ass man, so please act like it.
Some things are objectively better and the people defending that which isn't are making my experience worse. I'm gonna talk about it. Deal with it.
Consoles have exclusives. I much rather download an extra launcher than have to pay $400 for very similar hardware to use their special launcher to play a game. Also, if you have physical games, you have to deal with changing those out. PC, you're already on your PC so you just play the games you wanna play. Also, basically every time I've tried to play something on a playstation with someone, their PS needs and update and the game needs an update. PC games just update without me paying any attention to them on their own.
Consoles have advantages, but splitting launchers cross different hardware isn't a good thing about them. Its a negative.
They do. If I want to play one game, then I have to grab the disk and put it in its specific console to play it with its launcher. There's some exceptions, like gamecube games can be played on Wii's using its hardware and launcher. But if I want to the play a PS4 game, I have to switch to that hardware and the PS4 launcher. On PC, at least I can use retroarch as a single unified launcher for many consoles instead of buying several consoles to use each of them as a distinct launcher and steam for most everything else. No switching to the PS# launcher to run some things and the Switch launcher for different games. Even if a game has its own dedicated launcher on PC (probably enough reason for me to not bother playing), its still better than having to physically swap hardware to use its launcher.
No additional launchers or log ins, no waiting 30 minutes for the game to update
That happens on consoles all the time. Don't play your modern console (switch or newer) and the same thing happens. I avoid Xbox now because every time I go to play it's a 30 minute wait for system and game updates. -and my Xbox is hardwired Ethernet to 300 mbs service so it's not slow Internet
I even booted up my switch before family visiting on Thanksgiving because I knew it would want an update. At least Switch was nice by making it optional.
So you can't complain that a PC needs updating if you left it turned off for a when when consoles work exactly the same way.
I'm not though. Unless you open every launcher for every game whenever you open you PC then you still have that problem.
If I'm using my xbox regularly than that one game I havnt played in 8 months is going to stay updated. The same isn't true for PCs. I use mine every day, but the other week when I went to load up world of warships for the first time in a while I had a 12gb update because it has its own special launcher, so I just said fuck it and went to a different game.
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Another big win is game licences work for anyone using the console for all games. While some PC publishers require each individual user to buy another copy of the game in order to keep separate profiles. Looking at you, Ubisoft
Microsoft stopped short on PCs with their store.
If you're a parent, you can create a family group with your Microsoft account. Add each child's Microsoft account under yours. Purchase the game on your account. Login to your account on your childs PC to install it. Log out and then login to your childs account. They'll be able to play it.
Limitations? They will not have access to any DLC. It's limited to one child. If you have more than one child, too bad.
Absolutely hated it when I was forced to use it. Nowadays I don't mind that much anymore. But if a game needs to launch another launcher first, that drives me crazy.
Looking at you, EA and Ubishit.
I got into steam because I could (using modded files) download valve games for free. It was like piracy but without the torrenting and gameboxart.jpg.exe shenanigans.
Then I liked Counter Strike, and portal was coming out... and now I have a few thousand bucks in games.
Still don't like having to run a nanny program to be "allowed" to play the shit I paid for. But steam is the best of that garbage pile.
I got into it because I got Total War Napoleon (another annoying launcher with the Total War series nowadays…) and didn't realize beforehand that you needed an Steam account for it.
I came around to appreciate the storefront and library for my purchased digital games. But as you said, I don't want to have to run a nanny program to play my games. Especially my single player games.
That's what I like about gog though, I can just download an offline installer for my games from them. Although I think by now even they have games on their store that require launchers.
I use dedicated cpu cores and other tweaks on my setup to reduce game input latency. Steam is always the 1 fucking program that randomly starves my remaining cores for absolutely no reason
It’s such a garbage-tier app and always has been. Credit to Valve for busting open online app stores, but I have no idea why people like Steam so much.
but I have no idea why people like Steam so much.
Convenience is, I think, the primary driving force.
That's what I always find funny about the EGS hate crowd... They complain about the features it didn't have at launch (that it now has) but in the end having to launch any launcher pisses me off, might as well use the one with the least garbage! No Valve, I don't need fucking trading cards with my games!
Steam has a whole lot of useless features compared to Epic or GOG Galaxy, it's the most bloated launcher available at the moment. Do you need cards and tradable items linked to your account to play your games?
What's funny is that if the roles were reversed Epic would be accused of trying to monetize whales and gamblers, but no one bats an eye because it's Valve doing it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j95kNwZw8YY
Valve is also improving overall gaming experience by supporting Linux but go off about opportunistic Tim Swiney.
You're mixing up two separate debates, we're talking about the launcher experience, not about the OS they support.
It's clearly not part of this discussion because you can't compare the user experience on Linux when the product you want to compare to doesn't exist on it.
Also, you can just shut up if you can't have a discussion without insulting the people you're talking to, no one asked you to take part in the first place since clearly you're trying to derail the discussion.
thank you for the reminder to fetch my freebie for the week from epic. not that i actually play them (have a whole one title installed). i just collect those, too.
I love my launchers, I love to play!
I love more and more clicks each day.
I love my DRM, it is the best!
I love security and all the rest.
I love my software and its location, not having physical software is salvation.
I love my ads, they hold my attention, to spend more money is my intention!
I think my launchers are really swell, there’s nothing else I love so well.
I love to spend money on a microtransaction, its price is merely a microfraction
I love my local computer and its remote software;
I hug it often though it won’t care. I love each program and every distant file.
I’d love it more if I could download even more a while.
I’m happy the software is there, not here. I am. I am.
I’m the happiest slave of the launchers, I am.
I love these launchers, I love all the different cliques.
I love sharing personal information, I need my fix.
I love my launchers – I’ll say it again – I even love those friendly men.
Those friendly men who’ve come today,
In clean white coats to take me away!
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So called free market socialists when steam offers almost all the games in one launcher (monopoly)
at least they're using the money they get to make hardware that would not get greenlit otherwise due to too high market risks
and they didn't suddenly make the platform subscription only & put all the new features in the cloud to make it harder to pirate (looking at you Adobe you pos)
Also unlike console makers they don't try to limit you to only running software they approve on their hardware
Achievement unlocked: Starting to Excel
Would you like to share this Gaming Moment™ with your friends? Yes / yes.
I will say that I'll take the lesser evil of having an unintrusive launcher for a game that pops up after I select play in Steam (Creative Assembly, Larian, etc.) which can then be closed after the game starts than go back to when everyone wanted you to install a bloated distribution platform to play their specific game (Looking at you Stardock, Uplay, etc.).
Absolutely. It is refreshing to start BG3, see the launcher pop up quickly, and watch the loading splash come up right after you choose DX11/Vulkan.
There are, however, many other problems in that game.
This is why I buy most of my games from GOG.
The launcher (GOG Galaxy) is entirelly optional, so I don't use it at all and just download the installers for my games (and keep local copies in an external HD in my NAS).