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Israel tells Gazans to move south or risk being seen as 'terrorist' partner

https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/israel-tells-gazans-move-south-or-risk-being-seen-terrorist-partner-2023-10-22/

Palestinians said they had received renewed warnings from Israel's military to move from north Gaza to the south of the strip, with the added warning that they could be identified as sympathisers with a "terrorist organisation" if they stayed put.

Israel tells Gazans to move south or risk being seen as 'terrorist' partner

89 comments

ubermeisters

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Permanently Deleted

JoJoGAH

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From what I can see as of a couple hours ago, they've been bombing the south and refugee camps. So far they use this messaging as a way to corral and murder.

nbafantest

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They're being stopped from moving by Hamas

Marsupial

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Israel literally bombed an evacuation corridor they set up.

They said you can use these two routes between this time, it’ll be safe, and they still fucking bombed them.

Israel is stopping people from moving, Israel is murdering thousands of innocents and ruining millions of lives, Israel needs to be stopped.

ubermeisters

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Permanently Deleted

OccamsTeapot

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Source: trust me bro.

aniki

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90% of all the casualties of this conflict are innocent civilians.

Aceticon

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A few days ago there were already more Palestinian children killed by just the current Israeli bombing of Gaza that the total of Israelis killed by Hamas' attack.

Must have been "sympathisers with a terrorist organisation", same as the ones who will be killed and arrested when the IDF finally enacts their Gaza invasion and anexation plan. /s

foggianism

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What are the humanitarian aid measures done by Israel to help the affected civilians in Gaza?

Draedron

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They send in air packages in form of rockets

Aceticon

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Israel are activelly reducing the Palestinian needs for food, water and power (which Israel itself created) by killing them.

Noodle07

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Israel mesures: 🤷

ilikekeyboards

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All palestinian across this world cherish the Hamas party rule despite their violent rise to power in 2006 when they literally murdered their political opposition, the Fatah.

The Muslim fundamentalists in the Levant will never stop their aggression towards Jews. There was never a time when they were friendly or tolerant to other religions.

brandon

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It's a good thing we have you around to let us know what all Palestinians think

tomatopathe

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You make some strange and easily debunkable claims here.

If "all Palestinians" cherished Hamas there wouldn't be a Fatah or a PA.
The Israeli right wing literally supported Hamas over Fatah in order to justify continued violence and land theft against the Palestinians. Hamas and the settlers (who are now the Israeli government) are literally feeding off each other.
The main reason this attack succeeded was because the Gaza border was unmanned, because the current Israeli government moved the military to the West Bank in order to protect the settlers there while they commit attacks on the Palestinians there. Despite the Israeli military describing some of the actions of these settlers as a "progrom".
The "Muslim fundamentalists of the Levant" comprise Christians and other groups too, including Jews before this entire conflict started. There had been Jews in the Levant for millennia, despite it being under Muslim rule for 1400 years. Jews were still banned from Jerusalem under the Byzantines, until the Muslims conquered it and allowed Jews to return to the city. Jerusalem had a Jewish majority when the British took control of the place.
I find this idea that the hatred is exclusively due to anti-Semitism to be the stupidest one Israel tries to put out there. Had Palestine been occupied by Bhuddists or atheists, you think they would not resist, or hate their occupier? Was the Viet-Cong motivated by anti-Christian values in fighting both France and the USA? How stupid are you?

JoJoGAH

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I love you lemmy, this is why I'm here tkutkutku

aniki

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Permanently Deleted

Wrench

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Not all terrorists blow themselves up. Some have a victim hood complex and lash out from imagined persecution because their life has been too privileged to accept the thought of loss.

Source: MAGA

TwoGems

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Acktually, a MAGA did blow itself up!

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2020_Nashville_bombing

rambaroo

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Collective punishment is a crime against humanity.

Fatah is still in power in the west bank, you make it sound like they disappeared.

barsoap

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All palestinian across this world cherish the Hamas party rule

That statement is literally fascist. Not figuratively, not allegorically, not approximately, but precisely fascist.

Draedron

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You realize this argument is just as fascist as "all jews across the world want to control the global finances"?

barsoap

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No but you see that's their fascists saying things, not our fascists saying things. If ours say things they must obviously be true because they don't like them.

Mrkawfee

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Apart from the centuries of coexistence before Israel came along.

jet

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What's your resolution? Kill them all?

tony

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That you generalize all Palestinians this way is racist, and nowhere near true.

Here are polls showing that even 70% of Palestinians in Gaza wants the Palestinian Authority to take over power from Hamas:

https://www.washingtoninstitute.org/policy-analysis/polls-show-majority-gazans-were-against-breaking-ceasefire-hamas-and-hezbollah

Even in the 2006 election (the last held in Gaza) Hamas didn't even get a majority of votes (they got 44.45%). They were the largest party, and because of the electoral system they won a majority of seats.

dx1

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More war crimes

4lan

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I am getting the feeling that Israel (aka US) is creating more terrorists on purpose. If my entire family was killed and I survived I would be out for blood. I think anyone would.

Is this done just an excuse for the US to re-insert itself in a middle eastern conflict so our tax dollars can enrich the military industrial complex? Sure seems like it

We created our enemies in the Middle East, they would have no reason to hate us if we didn't.

Semi-Hemi-Demigod

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Hamas was created by Israel in the first place so you’re not wrong at all

4lan

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Not to mention the CIAs involvement in the formation of Al-Qaeda

These wars are not protecting America They are making us more vulnerable

What we do is not defense, it is conquest.

chaogomu

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You can win wars, but you cannot win an occupation.

But the people selling the guns sure as hell win.

AnyProgressIsGood

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Why do Palestinians play right into their enemies hands?

scarabic

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Setting aside the US for a moment, I think Israel’s embattled condition has always helped the Zionist cause. Being in a state of crisis binds the Israeli people together and draws foreign aid. There’s also a draw for Jewish people around the world to go defend the homeland. All of this draws in people and money to Israel. And of course it creates the martial conditions for them to forcibly exclude millions of Arabs from their “democracy.” If Israel had been peaceably founded and there was no separation with Gaza / the West Bank then Israel likely would have stopped being a Jewish majority, Jewish controlled state long ago. Now that their society is affluent and developed, they’re having a harder time keeping up on birth rates too. You can get people to have 8 kids on a farming kibbutz. Gen-Z ravers with tech jobs? Not so much.

Kepabar

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It's nothing so complicated as all that.

It's as simple as any possible solution to the issue is to Israels disadvantage, so they work to maintain the status quo.

Scubus

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Not sure why we need a reason, or to keep up a front.

No one looks at the war and says, "i really think itd be swell if the US got involved"

If its about momey or whatever, i feel like the people in power could just... invade? No need for fronts?

Stoneykins

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It's not just about money, it's also about approval raitings. Out of control and bizarre as it all feels, the individual politicians involved have to continually keep their supporters scared and seeking violent action (and therefore voting for them) or else a sane person might get elected and stop shoveling money into the war-engine.

Scubus

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I mean, when every single politician is a war monger, i still dont see what the point is. When the alternative is It'll-Be-Gone-By-Easter Trump, as they as they accept that science is a thing, any politician is fine. Their stance on the war is now completely irrelevant.

Stoneykins

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That is the point, maintaining a status quo of "all politicians are war mongers". They don't want to let any non-war mongers into the club.

foggy

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I'm stoned, and no simple explanation will be accurate.

But it basically works like this.

Invade -> Resources?

Yes -> take if non renewable. Banana Republic if renewable. Create enemies.

No -> create enemies.

Stir up tension with enemies neighbors and enemies.

Sell arms to one/both.

Play hero by putting a stop to this militant terrorist communist et ceteras.

Profit.

Summary

PipedLinkBot

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I'm open-source; check me out at GitHub.

febra

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Here comes more genocidal rhetoric out of Israel.

MrNesser

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He question here if all Palestinians are moving south whats to stop hamas moving with them and just leaving the north

AnyProgressIsGood

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Nothing but that's the ideal. You can hunt Intel. Implode tunnels. Setup larger dmz

Thorny_Insight

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Their rockets don't have the range to hit Israel from the south end of Gaza and that's probably where the majority of their tunnel infrastructure is at too.

jet

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It seems likely that Israel will take control of the north side of Gaza, and then settlers will start living in the north side of Gaza. Then the leftover Palestinians in the south side of Gaza will be in rocket range again. And the cycle will continue

nbafantest

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Thats exactly what Isreal wants. Then they can destroy the tunnels and rocket launch sites.

AnyProgressIsGood

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Man Israel Palestine threads are pure reactionary nonsense anymore

Thorny_Insight

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This is like watching sports. Everyone picks a team and after that nothing else matters than your team winning. If the opposing team gets a red card for nothing it's good and if your team gets one for a good reason it's bad. It's especially true in this case since there's almost nothing you can blame the other side for having done that the other haven't.

autotldr

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This is the best summary I could come up with:

GAZA, Oct 22 (Reuters) - Palestinians said they had received renewed warnings from Israel's military to move from north Gaza to the south of the strip, with the added warning that they could be identified as sympathisers with a "terrorist organisation" if they stayed put.

The message was delivered in leaflets marked with the Israel Defense Forces name and logo from Saturday and sent to people via mobile phone audio messages across the Gaza Strip, a narrow territory that is just 45 km (28 miles) long.

Your presence north of Wadi Gaza puts your life in danger.

Israel has pounded Gaza with airstrikes since the Palestinian militant group Hamas launched a deadly attack on Israeli soil on Oct. 7.

Israel has massed troops and armour on the border with Gaza ahead of an expected land incursion.

The Israeli military said in a statement it had "no intention to consider those who have not evacuated ... as a member of the terrorist group".

The original article contains 301 words, the summary contains 162 words. Saved 46%. I'm a bot and I'm open source!

GrammatonCleric

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Religion makes you crazy.

Mrkawfee

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They are preparing for ethnic cleansing

echo64

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https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=9ZSoJDUD_bU

ubermeisters

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Permanently Deleted

AmberPrince

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Jokes on you, my wife's Grandmother will click on any and every link she sees.

TWeaK

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If You Get Hit, It's Your Own Fault (The Simpsons) - From season 6 episode 8: Lisa on Ice

While it's not as ideal as you might like, there's nothing really wrong with just posting a link. Half the fun is in the surprise.

We're just chatting on the internet, it's impractical to expect every comment to be deeply thought out and fully constructed. Sometimes you just want to share something relevant and move on to the next thread. It's not like they masked a url with another or anything; any anger is unwarranted.

ubermeisters

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Permanently Deleted

TWeaK

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Lmfao you just came in and downvoted me at the same time as I finally conceded and accepted having a little edit mark on my comment.

I couldn't think of a better way to phrase it when I wrote the comment, but yes, "angry" would be an excessive description of your comment. Not quite so excessive with your latest comment, though :P

ubermeisters

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Permanently Deleted

TWeaK

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Lmao I'm just teasing you, also I haven't been downvoting you but upvoted your last comment. I respect your different opinion and mean no malice.

lolcatnip

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Asking for a link to have some indication of what it links to isn't demanding anything "deeply thought it and fully constructed". If you don't have time to write a few words to describe it, a hundred other people certainly don't have time to open it just to see what it is.

echo64

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If I posted what it was, it would have ruined the joke. What's to get mad about?

ubermeisters

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Permanently Deleted

PipedLinkBot

•

Here is an alternative Piped link(s):

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I'm open-source; check me out at GitHub.

count_dongulus

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In a republic, representatives in power are elected by the general populace. Their decisions represent the will of the citizenry.

Hamas was freely elected by the people of Gaza in 2006. Their actions did and continue to represent the will of the citizenry. If they didn't, they would not still be in positions of elected authority.

So, in a war of aggression by a democratic state, voting age adults are just as responsible for the actions of their country as the combatants they indirectly sent to harm others.

Gazan adults are either fighting Hamas, or they support Hamas. And I haven't read ANYTHING about Gazans against Hamas taking up arms to free their country from that elected group.

4lan

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That means that you are personally liable for the 1 Million dead civilians from our unconstitutional war in the middle east.

Using this logic you are fair game for a terrorist attack, and would deserve it.

50% of the population was not born yet during the most recent election where Hamas gained power (16 years ago)

Stop parroting this bullshit and think for yourself

count_dongulus

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I AM responsible. This is how democracy works. You are responsible for your own governance. Why don't you think for yourself? You can't vote for your government to kill others, and take zero responsibility.

jet

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And the people who didn't vote for the government? People who voted for the opposition but didn't win, are they innocent?

count_dongulus

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Yes, they are innocent. They did not consent to what their elected government is doing, assuming the actions being taken are from representatives they did not vote for.

jet

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https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2006_Palestinian_legislative_election

Hamas got 44% of the vote

Fatah literally fought Hamas for the Gaza strip. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Gaza_(2007) they lost. But they really really tried

So I think this paints a picture of a population divided. So all the people under 18 are innocent, we agree on that. And 66% of the adults are also innocent.

That's a lot of innocent people dying right now in the Gaza strip.

count_dongulus

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I don't disagree. Airstrikes and intelligence on where to put them can only be so reliable.

4lan

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So edgy. Hand yourself over to Al-Qaeda or ISIS since you are responsible. I will buy your plane ticket for you.

count_dongulus

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Nope, just because I'm part of a wide, very diluted group collectively responsible doesn't mean I think I am wrong. I am happy for voting representatives into power who used military force against Al-Qaida and ISIS. Fuck them.

4lan

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No you are going to the Middle East, send me a DM so we can get the plane ticket purchased

Put your money where your mouth is coward

goat

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But America isn't a democracy, it's a republic.

And even then, people don't vote on military decisions.

Cannacheques

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I somewhat agree on principle but practically speaking we live in very large systems with huge momentum these days, even in America where lots of people are armed and can avoid going to a war they don't want to, they're not necessarily going to bust moves against the system itself. If you ask me, the most effective action would simply be to buy your way out and enable mass freedom from such industrial war machines

Lmaydev

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This is a super simple view of the conflict.

They elected them in 2006. So there hasn't been an election in almost 20 years.

This is a stupid position to take imo.

count_dongulus

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Germans voted for the Nazi party to take power. And guess what? Germans supported that party, even after that party they chose to put into power suspended elections. If you elect a government that suspends elections, you're still responsible for electing that government. You put them there: you and your fellow citizens gave consent.

Shiggles

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Yes famously every single german citizen unanimously supported the nazi party from 1933 to 1945.

Have you ever learned about how the Nazis came into power? The cycle that Hitler became Chancellor, they won only 37% of the vote. Before that, it was a meager 18%. One election of 37% was enough for emergency powers to be seized, the reichstag to be burned, and quite simply the ball to be put in motion. I’m sure you would’ve been first in line to protest their actions beyond that point, but it certainly would’ve been quite the challenge to change the course after that point.

If you’re cool damning an entire population off the decision of 37%(of the population that voted), then I guess your reasoning stands.

filister

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Funny that you mention it, but do you know why Germans voted for the Nazis, because they were desperate and put into a corner, after the end of the WWI and the Versailles treaty they were so bad economically that people were desperate, and guess what, desperate people choose desperate solutions. So in a way, Hamas is in power thanks to the Israelian policies.

Do you truly believe that if those people were in peace and living comfortably Hamas would have been elected in the first place?

Lmaydev

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This is just straight wrong in so many ways I'm afraid.

aniki

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https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Resistance_during_World_War_II

jet

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Taking your same logic, every citizen of every country is responsible for whatever that country does. That means all of the grievances the people of Gaza have are the responsibility of every citizen of Israel.

Your advocating the doctrine of Total war. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Total_war

Lots of civilians die in Total war. On both sides. Using this logic everyone's going to die

Cannacheques

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Technically the most natural state of tribalism and humanity lol

count_dongulus

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No, every voting eligible citizen in a democratically elected government is responsible for a war of aggression. They are giving consent to the war of aggression. That is how democracy works: you the citizen decide your own governance, and you are not magically absolved of responsibility for the actions of the government you elected.

jet

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Okay, by that logic, the vast majority of the people in the Gaza strip are innocent. The last election was in 2004. The vast majority of people in Gaza are under 18.

count_dongulus

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Yes, those people are innocent. I have no qualms with that.

aniki

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Sounds like you do, homie.

lolcatnip

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In a republic, representatives in power are elected by the general populace. Their decisions represent the will of the citizenry.

Are you 12?

AmberPrince

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Ya he's giving off some real Libertarian/FrEe MaRkEt/whatevenistheageofconsent vibes

count_dongulus

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No, I am a voter. Do you know how government works? Are you 12?

filister

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There weren't any elections since Hamas took control of Gaza, they have persecuted and expelled/killed all Fatah representatives.

Maybe before saying something try to educate yourself.

lolcatnip

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I'm someone who understands that:

Governments aren't always elected with the support of a majority of voters, or even a plurality.
A government does not represent the will of the voters who weren't on the winning side of the last election
A government often doesn't represent the will of the voters on the winning side either.
People vote based on what candidates say they're going to do, and they have next to no control over what their leaders actually do after they're elected.

Sounds like you don't understand those very basic facts. Your opinions are therefore not worth listening to.

Gerula

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Unfortunately, you don't understand the basics of living in a society. Please stop being arrogant and don't assume you have an opinion worth listening to.

Blapoo

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https://www.npr.org/2023/10/18/1206897328/half-of-gazas-population-is-under-18-heres-what-that-means-for-the-conflict

dlatch

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Due to the Israeli blockade of goods and travel, these people were happy if they can survive the day to day. let alone fight a regime that even the 4th strongest army in the world is failing to control. But sure, it's their own fault.

endhits

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50% of the population of Gaza is 15 or lower. The majority of the people there never voted for Hamas.

Gerula

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Hey, you cannot say that here! It doesn't fit the general narrative. What are you thinking? /s

aniki

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What are you thinking?

Nazi punks fuck off

Gerula

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😂

Name calling. And all of the sudden you're right! But hey, you forgot "bigot" from your answer, we all know you're not truly right until you call me a bigot!

aniki

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Cry more.

Gerula

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😂😂😂

goat

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why are you thinking that?

aniki

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This thread is full of Nazis apologizing for apartheid Israel calling for ethnic cleansing of Palestine. You know -- Nazi shit.

Gerula

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Yes, we all know that historically Israel has a tendency towards nazism.

goat

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No, they're not.

Neo-Nazis are actually quite pro-Hamas, their hatred of Jews and queers exceeds their hatred of muslims. You can verify this yourself by visiting pol or any other neo-nazi site.

aniki

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Ok Nazi. Blocked.

goat

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