How can we make the revolution happen when the NSA and CIA know everything that we talk about online?

"How can we have a revolution if the Tsar's secret police read our newspapers and intercept our mail?"

These are and should be just general discussion forums.

If you want to organize politically do it somewhere like a self-hosted Matrix chat, or any other appropriate End-to-End Encrypted service (Not WhatsApp. Telegram isn't E2EE by default.)

The thing is, if you're dealing with nation-state actors, just accept that you don't and never did have privacy. Especially if you've somehow made yourself a target in their eyes.

In the meantime enjoy the fact that they currently probably don't give a shit that you exist.

I don't have a coherent plan for you, but here are some thoughts:

• Don't talk online.
• Not sure how much you can achieve if you're so far away that you need the internet to communicate, tbh.
• The internet is a tool that has certain applications. Organising the revolution probably isn't one of them. It's good for education. It's maybe good for emergency messaging ('so and so got arrested; send the lawyer to precinct X'). It's good for news and keeping up with other struggles. That's probably it.
• I hear about the internet being used to organise protests. But I've yet to see a protest achieve much. Probably because they're are infiltrated because they're organised in public, but if you want loads of people to show up, you've got to forget about secrecy and just tell people.
• Same applies to organising a workplace. Some secrecy is necessary but beyond that it needs democracy, publicity, and transparency. There's always a balance to strike.
• A revolution requires organisation. To start with, we/you need to organise with other workers in some way. This will invite bad actors/spies, which will undermine any technical security measures: no password or encryption will help you if you can't spot the agent in the room.
• It depends on where you live (you mention the CIA and NSA so I assume the US but can't be certain because they're everywhere). You must analyse local conditions and local threats.
• If you're in the States, you're not going to be having anything like a Cuban or Chinese revolution. You simply will not be able to keep the organisation of an armed force secret for long enough to be prepared enough to take down the US militarily. You have to consider what a revolution might look like in your country, then work out what tools and steps you need to take to bring it about.
• We did a reading group on a book called Revolution in the Revolution by Debray, which you might find interesting (search this site for NEBulae). You can't transplant whatever worked in one country to another country without modification.
• All reactionaries are paper tigers. They only have power because workers do as they're told. They don't have the strength to resist revolution on their own. But you won't reveal their papery core unless you organise workers. Until then, their teeth and claws are sharp enough.
• The problem in the west is that the majority of people are labour aristocrats without any class consciousness. They will defend capitalism long before you have to worry about the NSA and CIA. Westerners need to figure out that problem before they need to worry about going head-to-head with the state in a 'revolution'.

Talk in person. That’s it.

Never talk about anything incriminating online, and if you are ABSOLUTELY FORCED TO, use a peer to peer encryption network.

Carrier pigeons.

you use briar and an elaborate system of dead drops, Bluetooth, and sneakernet. possibly one time pads and encrypted transmission by radio once things pick up. of course radio transmissions can be triangulated, so...

in any case you can expect infiltration in your organization so cryptography has some limitations in what it can accomplish. in any case you shouldn't post anything incriminating online, ever

Use things with E2E encryption like signal and matrix?

Try to meet in person as much as possible and only use those E2E services once you have met the person.

At least three things are required for any mass political change to happen:

1. A critical mass of people taking proactive, organized action.
2. A chunk of people who may not be organized, but who will join a proactive, organize action.
3. A chunk of people who may not take proactive steps, but who aren't going to go to the mat for the old regime.

2 and 3 are probably the most important -- they're essentially the difference between an interest group and a mass movement -- and probably the hardest for modern intelligence to stop. They try (look at social media astroturfing and legacy media influence), but your propaganda line can only deviate so much from reality before people reject it. Other comments address accomplishing 1 despite interference.

Alternatively, we can make an army of bots that just post assassination plots and riot plans everywhere, and hide the real plots within it.

The intention is explicitly to prevent any complete reform.

And offline and on air gapped machines if they wished. In person and not only that in code as well hidden under other things, traditionally book clubs were used but that's a well known, anything with wide interpretation like the arts or even the occult are good ones and it doubles as a way to agripop too potentially or it could be just merely aesthetics to the unaware eye, also allows you to play very it straight as required and blend in.

You go way back to fighting the godly power of kings and people got real creative about dealing with it, we're dealing with a whole pantheon now. There are so many ways one could not even think of them all, they may have a near perfect panopticon but processing the data is another matter anyhow. Read books about creativity and idea generation as well. There's good opsec guides around and on 6bear.

By posting about it in an ultra-public social media channel, absolutely nobody will suspect it just being out in the open like that.

Permanently Deleted

Define "revolution" and who are you fighting? Your neighbours? Their bodies or their minds?