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The Gruesome Story of How Neuralink’s Monkeys Actually Died

https://www.wired.com/story/elon-musk-pcrm-neuralink-monkey-deaths/

Elon Musk says no primates died as a result of Neuralink’s implants. A WIRED investigation now reveals the grisly specifics of their deaths as US authorities have been asked to investigate Musk’s claims.

The Gruesome Story of How Neuralink’s Monkeys Actually Died

41 comments

ninjan

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I really hope the people signing up for the human trials are well informed. While I think implants like Neuralink are going to revolutionize treatment for all kinds of paralysis Musk has a track record of giving absolutely no fucks about safety or regulations unless forced to.

RaincoatsGeorge

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Exactly. There will be a time where we can safely place this tech and help people who are paralyzed walk again or talk again. But trusting this dipshit is madness. He used to come off as a cool genius but that’s all over. He’s just an idiot who has too much money and buys whatever he thinks is cool.

He justifies all of this suffering and torture because in his mind he’s got a major Kanye complex where he thinks he’s an Adonis god. Bro you’re an amorphous fat pasty neck beard who got lucky in the dot com boom and bust. Real lucky. Please just go climb a wall of dicks and get fucked.

mvirts

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Ya billionaire psychopaths are not ideal medical research drivers

RaincoatsGeorge

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Especially when they cannot be wrong and will force their underlines to lie, falsify data, etc.

This tech has a place in actual medical researchers hands. Not this soy boys sweaty piss fingers.

Shdwdrgn

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You want to show the world how cool your new tech is? Get the procedure done on yourself first before you're allowed to experiment on anyone else. I bet that would slow down his desire to push out unsafe ideas to fulfill his greed.

RaincoatsGeorge

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Oh my god I’d love for Elon to be in alpha testing.

Catoblepas

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Or we wind up with Titan 2.0. Given how many stupid situations of his own causing Musk has survived it wouldn't surprise me if he'd do it and then be shocked when his head explodes from a bad battery.

Bipta

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I'm willing to trust them a lot more when it's not literally brain implants.

Jessvj93

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Got lucky, pfft I remember how PayPal would screw folks over constantly and he got there by taking advantage of them.

kent_eh

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Musk has a track record of giving absolutely no fucks about safety or regulations unless forced to.

While he is a particularly egregious and blatant example, there are countless examples of other corporations generating their profits by doing exactly the same level of ignoring safety, environmental damage, and other harms ti society in their single-minded pursuit of ever inreasing profits.

Internalize the profits and externalize the costs has been a business mantra for centuries.

Gamey

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It's actually not that many, for most conditions these things can be used for other methods seem saver and more promising but there are cases where they will help people.

zephyreks

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That's literally the exact thing rewarded by capitalism. Don't blame the player, blame the game

exohuman

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That was hard to read. Those monkeys suffered greatly. I understand the need for animal trials in a device such as this though. My question is do they really think they will be able to support humans for their entire lifetime properly who get this implant? I can imagine humans being told the company went under or something when it’s time to maintain their implant.

xuxebiko

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Yes, it was a difficult read. This was more animals being unnecessarily tortured than animal testing. and Musk's lying about their suffering and deaths. He and his Neuralink team are psychopaths.

greenhorn

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I've read about this exact thing, people with debilitating conditions who are offered state of the art tech to be implanted, but the company eventually folds and they stop maintaining or supporting it, so the people are left with a useless implant

Gork

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While I'm all for the possibility of brain-machine interfacing so we can communicate better with our devices, there ain't no way whatsoever that I'm putting anything that Musk creates inside my brain.

MrGG

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You get it put in and suddenly you think Musk is a sexy genius, apartheid wasn't that bad, and that Tesla cars definitely aren't trying to kill you.

fubo

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Just so ya know, the Musk emerald mine was in Zambia, which did not have apartheid.

https://www.snopes.com/news/2022/11/17/elon-musk-emerald-mine/

MrGG

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I'm not sure what that has to do with anything? I didn't mention the emerald mine.

FlexibleToast

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Okay... But Musk is from South Africa, which very much did have apartheid.

fubo

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I'm from Oregon, which was founded as a white separatist colony. I'd prefer to judge Musk on his support for fascism in the US, his unsafe rocket launches, and his monkey torture ... not on his birthplace.

idiomaddict

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That’s all true. However, it’s helpful to see what foundational values he was raised with. If your parents had been rich and influential and completely on board with keeping Oregon a sundown state, that would not be irrelevant. Even if you hated it and them, it would have some role in your life.

FlexibleToast

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I agree. There is plenty to dislike about him that where he is from doesn't really have to be part of it.

Donebrach

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How the hell could anyone think inserting technology into your brain is a good idea? Especially for the completely useless “benefit” of being able to “communicate with our devices.” Do you seriously want push notifications funneling into your subconscious? I’m guessing your takeaway from cyberpunk media is “ooo! cool hot murderbabes and gun arms!”

pimento64

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While I'm all for the possibility of brain-machine interfacing so we can communicate better with our devices

For the folks at home, the commenter I'm responding to is one of the ones who will be the death of us all in 30 years.

Revan343

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the ones who will be the death of us all in 30 years

Naw, that's the climate change deniers

toomanyjoints69

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Dying for your treats

Pxtl

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This is the grim reality of animal testing, which is why it's always important to consider if a product is worth testing for.

Edit, forgot the link: cracked.com/personal-experiences-1676-5-horrifying-realities-testing-drugs-lab-animals.html

Cracked (rip) wrote an amazing first-person account of what animal testing is like. It's basically an ongoing massacre. The animals aren't even livestock or raw materials... they're basically just stationery. Valueless office supplies.

magnetosphere

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Unfortunately, especially when it comes to medical research, there’s often no viable alternative. The horrible lack of ethics shown here provide a strong case for strengthening existing laws and oversight, however. I agree: we should have higher standards when considering whether something is “worth testing for”.

deegeese

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Isn’t that the definition of livestock?

Business asset (stock) that is alive.

juliebean

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here's that link but clickable. that was quite the... enlightening read.

pgp

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Non-paywalled link

andresil

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The true MVP of this post

Candelestine

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Y'know... he's pissed off a lot of people over the years with various stunts and statements, but to my knowledge he had not really done anything yet to really piss off PETA. Now, every political faction is going to have its range from more moderate, less aggressive individuals, to more ... let's say, hands-on, individuals. A lot of those on the left end up with groups like PETA or those anti-whaling guys, fighting for animal rights. While I often support their ideas, I must acknowledge that they are often more than willing to use methods based on expediency and effectiveness over legality or safety.

They're really not an enemy you want, if you could avoid that.

CanadaPlus

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That's... not nearly as bad as I was bracing for. They got infections (pretty common for brain implants) and the things got loose or broke sometimes. The critters were then euthanised.

Musk is still a bald face liar, though. Especially about the "old, terminal monkeys" part.

PowerCrazy

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Yea Musk sucks, but there isn't anything really shocking or surprising about the details of animal testing.

PP_BOY_

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No, but to then turn around and lie about the cause of death is super unethical and fraudulent to investors.

PowerCrazy

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Sure agreed. But again we already all know and agree that Musk sucks.

Gamey

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I wish that extended outside of the Lemmy bubble but people are unbelivably stupid!

SkaveRat

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Musk's remarks aside (because anything he says is basically filtered through is """grand visions"""), the cases in the article seem like somewhat standard animal testing cases.

The only borderline case would be Animal 15, imo. Having her live with an implant for "months" while it seems uncomfortable seems cruel, but even there I could see why they did it.

In the grand scheme of things, it's by far not the worst things we're doing with animal testing. Be it rodents or primates.

It some point, tech like this needs to be tested against living organisms (if we want to advance in this area of tech)

andresil

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This isn't quite normal, usually at these facilities in the case of 15, 22, and 20 especially show that the workers are not carrying out proper regular assessment and that the criteria for euthanasia for excessive suffering looks to be far to high. I only know the case of how this kind if testing is handled with mice (from my partner, and in germany) and all three of these cases would have been euthanized much earlier, not left to live on for a year or even days. As usual with Musk, he tries to cut corners and it only ends up hurting people and in this case animals unecessarily.