https://www.pcgamer.com/apple-finally-put-usb-c-in-the-new-iphone-but-its-inexplicably-limited-to-23-year-old-usb-20-speeds/
Apple has dragged the iPhone kicking and screaming into the USB-C era, but with an embarrassingly antiquated USB protocol.
Okay and? I transferred an album to my phone via USB two days ago. Your experiences are not the same as others'.
I too haven’t plugged my phone in to transfer anything since the 6s, obviously there are people who do like yourself and Apple limiting transfer speeds is ridiculous but the majority of people are basically using the cable for charging, I don’t have data to prove it but anecdotally I’d bet I’m right
They shouldn’t have capped the speeds but I highly doubt this will be an issue that the average person cares about
That’s fine. If you’re using an iPhone you’ll literally get better speed for the last decade by unplugging your phone and doing the exact same thing over WiFi.
Different poster here: WiFi sucks and my whole house is wired for gigabit Ethernet. I use USB as well for this reason.
That's not the only reason for fast I/O though. Yeah it's convenient for a quick transfer/backup of large files but there's also the ability to use peripherals that require higher rates. USB3 has been around since 2008 so it's not really unreasonable to expect a modern phone to support a spec that's over a decade old...
So your argument is unless you have sex no one needs an organ for it?
More to the point USB can be used for so much more than just data transfer. I know Apple hasn't provided you folk with any option like those and it's a "revolutionary and brave move" waiting to happen 5-10 years after everyone else... but my phone has HDMI out, USB hub which has keyboard, mouse and external drive connected. You know, you can charge your phone and do work and use your device?
Wow, that seems kind of cool actually.
I wonder if a phone could replace a ThinkPad? I mean it'd probably be sluggish but maybe okay to use?
A link to that dock station thingy of yours?
It's a simply USB C hub with HDMI, LAN, memory card reader, etc. It can charge your device while providing HDMI output and the rest of desktop experience. Nothing too special, VAVA VA-UC006
Simple and elegant, thanks for the link!
Gotta get one of those Linux telephones now (so I can be disappointed I guess 😅), always having your PC with you would be so swell.
You are welcome. There are pocket sized PCs out there running both Linux and Windows. Right now this works for me. :)
I can plug in one cable into my device (S21 Ultra) which will allow me to charge at 45W and use a desktop interface with a separate mouse, keyboard, and monitor, all at the same time.
Seriously… the number of people plugging their phones in to transfer anything to/from an iPhone is in the single digit percentages, if that.
I work with Apple products all day and work with people using them every day. I can’t remember when we had someone who actually plugged in their phone to do anything other than charge. My company has been working with iPhone users every day for years so we’re talking thousands of people. I have a pretty good sample size and would say that our work basically amounts to extensive research.
Also, just look at the responses here and otherwise. Even the number of people that still demand a headphone jack is limited to techies and less-than-single-digit percentages.
The downvoted here are insane. Just Android fanboys trying to dunk on iPhones for a reason no iPhone user cares about at all. I agree 100%. No one buying the non-pros plugs in for data transfer anymore.
I know. It’s ok. I have a MagSafe charger on my nightstand and sync everything else to iCloud, Google Drive, and a NAS, depending on the need. There is literally no reason for me to ever plug this thing in.
so very apple to punish it's own users because they have too many old components they need to use up, but if you're paying for PRO you get actual 2023 modern USB.
so very, very apple.
the adaptor is usb3, the controller interface limits you to usb 2.0 speed. what part of the article was hard to comprehend?
Connector is USB type C, controller inside of it supports USB up to version 2. With USB you have different connectors but all of them are backwards compatible. So yes, Apple put outdated chip in the phone on regular versions so you get only USB 2.0 speeds. Type C is obviously capable of much more than USB 2, power delivery included... which is the part of OP statement. You get modern connector with outdated interface. Next year they will just trickle down Pro hardware to regular phones and call it "upgrade". That's what Apple does.
Well, they put last year’s chip in the phone, which does not support USB 3 speeds. If the non Pro iPhone 16 won’t support usb 3, then it’s deliberate kneecapping. Now it’s just unfortunate.
I still find it scummy that you get a year old hardware at current year prices. If the price was not at flagship level, then sure you could justify older chips.
Well, the price isn’t at flagship level. At least not from Apple’s view. You pay less, you get less (which is still en par if not ahead in most regards, compared to the competition)
Simple anchoring effect at work. Price flagship higher, so expensive "cheap" option looks cheaper by comparison. Truth of the matter is, it's all inflated prices, not only exclusive to Apple.
It's kind of funny that when they used lightning, they got a pass for failing to keep up with the industry standard that's over a decode old.
Well, not really. Most people complained for years now about lightning. Not necessarily about the lack of usb 3 speeds but that’s probably because for the vast majority of people, that doesn’t matter
What part of their comment was hard to comprehend?
They're just saying even the usb 3.0 in the pro model is not modern.
Lately the base model is usually last year’s old pro processors and micro controllers. Next year the base 16 will probably have the faster IO if the trend continues.
Completely agree. No company redesigns all of their products each year. They redesign the top tier and then its shifts downward the next year. GPU, CPU, Motherboard, hell even cars do this. Not all models included Carplay and Android Auto when it launched, just the high end cars did, but now all of them do.
USB IO speed aside, Apple's phones have gotten to the point where 3 and 4 year old chipsets are still VERY performant. They now have the wiggle room to put more bleeding edge silicon in top tier phones, be ok with smaller yields at first, and scale fabrication over the year.
That all being said, given that everyone was going to been eyeing this USB port, they probably should've taken one on the chin and changed the stupid IO speed. Although, the people complaining about this probably aren't Apple's core market anyway. So maybe they were right.
My XS Maxxx is many many years old at this point and it’s STILL SO FAST!
I’ve also never reformatted it, which is wild.
The USB controller is not part of the CPU. IO controllers are usually separate silicon that is attached to the motherboard, an expansion slot, etc.
Did you watch the presentation? They literally showed and said the usb controller was part of the A17 Pro SoC
I suspect next year’s base will have a revised version of this year’s processor. The iPhone 15 Pro has an A17 Pro. This is the first A Series chip with a “Pro” label. I don’t expect something “Pro” to make it into the base model.
What will change between the A17 Pro and the A17? Who knows. It might include the upgraded USB controller though.
This is Apple at it again, do bare minimum and charge premium. They left USB2 because it required no work, but they had to put type C because EU regulation. Since USB is backwards compatible, solution is just solder half of the connector, charge premium price and fuck you customers. And they are right, people don't care. Instead they go defending it like "I don't need it anyway", "Am not a pro, I don't need it", etc.
Ah, yes last year. Usb 2.0 was invented in, like what, 2001? A shitty phone cpu from 2 years ago is probably at least as powerful as the pentium 4 I had back in the day. Come the fuck on.
Just saying that I wouldn’t be surprised if they were reusing some boards or controllers with limited throughput that their manufacturing plants and fabs were already pumping out. Cook got famous for being an operational efficiency nerd that made sure Apple had very little spare parts and inventory on the books.
But yeah, iPhone physical IO speeds have been slow for a looong time. My guess is that so much of Apple’s install base is syncing over the cloud that it hasn’t been a priority.
The biggest applause at the in-person event was, no lie, for the larger cloud storage plans.
they don't care because apple punishes the poors at every opportunity anyway. soldered on ram & ssd's on their laptops for fucks sake
You kind of chose the wrong series laptop to point this out. X series ThinkPad is ultra-portable line where sole focus is on weight and thickness. You can make an argument that memory clip doesn't weigh a lot, but they really reduce every gram they can. Literally every other series has clip-on RAM.
Even if we ignore RAM, on ThinkPad pretty much everything is replaceable with a single screwdriver. Literally anything. You grab FRU#, find part that matches it and off you go. With Apple it's ungluing battery, ripping things apart. Hell even keyboard is riveted into the case and you have to drill holes and make threads to replace it. It's not comparable at the slightest.
ugh... please don't support companies that do this. I'd never purchase a pc laptop that didn't allow ram or ssd upgrades. insanity! I SAY!
the dumbing down and enshittification will only proceed if people buy their products.
dunno why you're downvoted, you're completely correct.
BUT
Apple is the only one charging eye-watering prices for the privilege. Yeah, there is that lol.
It's funny (or sad I guess) that the current generation of laptops are back on mag chargers (I forget what they're called) instead of USB C. There was never a time when both iPhones and MacBooks used USB C charging.
Sorry, should've clarified I meant the end of the cord that comes in the box that you're meant to plug into the laptop
I don't have one, but I thought the user could either do magsafe or a usb-c to a laptop, either way will charge.
Haven't used that charger since day 1 of receiving my work MBP M1. I just plug it into a Thunderbolt dock that supports usb-pd
Or because the base iPhone 15 uses last year’s Pro chip which didn’t have a USB3 controller.
A Raspberry Pi from years ago has USB 3.1. Restricting the latest iPhone is just laughable.
And probably have a separate controller? I’m not very technical at all but I’d assume it’s much easier to fit a separate one on a large surface like the iPad has
Edit: google confirms the iPads have a separate USB3 controller
I had a very quick check and I think iPads use an external chip for USB 3 - and there may just not have been space on the iPhone’s logic board for that. I think you’d have to judge it next year - since the base models seem to be using last year’s pro chips - if the base model doesn’t support 3.1 speeds then, something fishy is happening
Apple does a lot of BS stuff, but are you trying to claim the controller in iPads and iPhones is the same, or comparable because of age? Because that’s like claiming the screens are the same, or comparable.
More like standard capitalism. The usb c connectors are not slower then the lightning connectors so its not like they made it worse. They simply refused to make it better.
A bit like Nvidia continuing to maken better gpu chips but refusing to have them release with a more VRAM.
If course in a way, all for profit-companies are malicious. Extracting surplus value from workers and such.
Apple was forced by the EU to stop using their old and worse connector
So they're complying, but they're purposefully limiting the less expensive phone as a malicious compliance to that
Pretty simple really
So lightning cables offer transfer rates of 480Mb/s - USB 2.0 offers 625Mb/s. You are cross that they swapped out Lightning for USB on the main models and use USB 3 as a differentiator in the Pro models. Fair enough, but that's not 'malicious'. It's not even malicious compliance.
Lightning connectors are definitely worse than USB-C, but when they were introduced the alternative was micro USB which is objectively worse than Lightning cables.
Of course, with wireless charging I haven't used an actual cable in five years so it doesn't matter that much to me.
You mean the Apple that provided more than 20% of the engineering force that developed USBC?
Or the Apple that released the first USBC laptop to market?
That Apple?
Or the apple that fought against USB-C for their phones since basically forever and now implemented it with USB 2? Yes, this one.
Apple's base model hardware usually uses last year's pro chipsets. They've been doing this for a bit now.
If the trend continues, next year the base model will get all the newer CPUs, micro controllers, etc.
If the aim of a company is to maximize profits then every company in Apple's stead would do the same thing. Not defending it but that's the world we created.
It does feel kind of spiteful. But honestly, it is surprisingly difficult to find USB 3 USB-C cables anyway. Most of them are USB 2 unless you spring for Thunderbolt cables.
No they're not? At least when I check amazon or any other online retailer, USB-C cables are almost always USB 3.0 or higher. Only the ultra cheap ones are not.
We’re talking USB-C to USB-C right?
Do you have links for some of the ones you looked at? Because I checked a few Anker and Apple cables and they were all USB 2.0.
It does seem to be easier to get USB 3 Type A to type C cables, but not C to C.
I was skeptical but then I went to the Google store and looked at their USB-C cables and they are also USB 2.0 speeds.
I swear I have a USB C cable that charges faster oriented one way. I haven't really proved it or anything but it really does feel like it. Maybe I'm crazy. Is it possible? It's "normal" USB on the other side.
I had a cable which only charged plugged in one way up. I assume some of the pins were damaged.
Welcome to the Android world where even good smartphones worth 400 $ only support USB 2.0
Most Androids still only get USB2.0, but not the ones that are in the price range of the iPhone.
Edit: Feels like I'm back on Reddit with people not reading my comment, I just said that although most units of Android phones are budget to mid-range, mine being a mid-range (Poco F3), Android phones anywhere near the range of an iPhone in Cost is USB 3.0+
I bought my oneplus 10 pro for sub $500 during a sale, and it has usb3.1. It's last year's model. You can get a pixel 6 with usb3.1 for less than $400. A Galaxy S21 has usb3.2, less than $500.
That's almost every major android brand for $500 or less with 3.1 or better. The cheapest you can buy an iPhone 15, the one with usb2.0, is $800. What are you on about?
Cheap as in 100 and less brand new? The third-party market can get you a usb3 type c port from a 2 year old phone at that price range. This is cheap to have. Apple is not doing it because it costs money, but it is a plus for them. They are doing it to push power users, who know enough about technical specs, to buy the more expensive product. The pro has USB 3, and even then, the charging speeds are 12 watt. They are trickling the upgrades ever slower now because the technological advances have slowed down. They are doing it to create hype and advertising the new stuff every year instead of drastically changing their product. It is planned absolesence from making certain parts weak on purpose.
Most units are budget/mid-range, I've got a fairly good mid-range Poco F3 and it's still USB 2.0, most units of android phones are that or below.
I said that everything close to price range of an iPhone is USB 3.0 or greater. The point was that the iPhone 15 is A$1500 and has the same port as my A$600 2-yr old android. The budget specs of the base model is absurd enough without being hyperbolic.
I don't use data on the USB port very often and when I do it's always to make an access point over USB so the USB2.0 bandwidth is enough for my use.
I wonder if people really have a use for USB3.
Apart from making phone more expensive, I don't see a real need for me
Argument can be made if your camera doesn't support 4k or 60fps, there's very little need for higher speeds than USB2.0 since files generated won't be as big. However if you keep using your phone as a camera to record long videos, then yes it's annoying to have slower interface.
That's a valid point.
Also is there's a USB3 controller at all in the phone to connect the camera inside the phone? Or does the camera talk on a different bus on the SoC?
With Apple devices I honestly don't know. With others SoC is the one exposing the rest of the hardware and acts are intermediate. Historically in general giving DMA access to any hardware on the system has proven fatal when it comes to security. You do gain speed, but expose so much in the process.
i got an like 7 year old phone and it supports type c. The only reason that it did cost more because the manufacturer is expensive.
If you get an Android i suggest looking out for a phone with less bloatware than Samsung. Then the experience is way better
USB-C is a connector and, by itself, says nothing about the protocol in use. That’s the important part.
5Ghz wifi and Airdrop is what Apple wants people to use. I stopped connecting a USB cable except for doing a physical backup with iMazing on this 256GB model. I just trust the hard line more when making a 232GB backup.
Source: https://www.tomshardware.com/news/usb-3-2-explained
5 Gbps to MB/s = 625 MB/s 6 Gbps to MB/s = 750 MB/s 7 Gbps to MB/s = 875 MB/s 8 Gbps to MB/s = 1000 MB/s 9 Gbps to MB/s = 1125 MB/s 10 Gbps to MB/s = 1250 MB/s
That has nothing to do with whether it's USB 2.0 or 3.0 because it's backwards compatible. What phone do you have?
How is it backwards compatible with fast charging if it only fast charges in 3.0 ports but not 2.0 ports? It will work in 2.0 sure, but it doesn't fast charge over it since 2.0 doesn't have the same electrical output as 3. I have a LG Thinq V6.
That phone isnt 6 years old, it was released in 2020. It wasnt $350 either but $800. Weird points youre trying to make...
after a little time most of these handsets see deep discounts and special pricing from carriers
I paid $350 for it, for certain. I thought I got it in 2018 but it seems I'm just misremembering.
The main point is that android certainly uses USB 3.0 pretty commonly, and not just 2.0. If it fast charges, it ain't fucking 2.0.
USB Power Delivery (fast charge) doesn't require USB 3.0 speeds, just USB-C connectors.
Disagree. My Redmi Note 11 can charge up to 33W using my current Anker Nano II (65W), previously UGREEN 20W charger. It has USB-C 2.0 port.
I love how these articles happen and are posted and everyone flames at apple.
This isn’t that different than the Galaxy note 20 not having ultra wide band but the Ultra version does.
All companies do this, otherwise why have different tiers or different models.
Don’t get me wrong, I am thrilled they are finally using USB-C. I enjoyed the lightning when if first came out. The only cord at the time you could plug in and there was no up or down, it just want in no matter what orientation. Apple just wanted to charge everyone to use it and they screwed up with that. Now there is a full standard for every device, this is good.
Apple fan boys and Android fan boys need to chill out. It’s just a phone, not an allegiance.
I didn't know what ultra wide band was because i never heard of it and...wow! Are you seriously comparing a very high tech stuff that only started to being added to high-end smartphones since 2019 (i still don't know what it's for) to apple forcefully crippling the speed of usb to what it was more than 10 years ago ? That's whack ! I can't even start to understand your thoughts process. Other famous company did something that can be considered similar if you tilt your head hard enough ( to stop blood from flowing to the brain that is ) so you see ? the company i love isn't fucking me sideways like y'all are saying. WTF !??
It seems to be that you are misunderstanding the entire tech concept. There is no "downgrading" the A16 chip from last year’s pro model is the USB controller. They simply aren't upgrading that chip. It seems that you didn't read the article and thus didn't know the processors for the phone are what are controlling the USB. There is no "forcefully crippling the speed of usb" its a simple matter of taking last years top tier chip and putting it in the Second tier phone this year. This is how tech works. You don't redesign all your products, you redesign the top tier and then move those advancements down the chain next year.
The comparison was not about a cable vs wifi. It was about the chip on the device as that is the crux of the situation and the pointed out almost at the top of the article.
No need to be rude or insulting with the blood flowing to the brain comment. Again this seems to be fan boy attitude to shit on "the other side" and be insulting to win the argument. I have no stake in this other than pointing out that people are freaking out and getting upset because they didn't redesign the phone and architecture for $X to increase the speed of something almost no IOS user even uses.
An honest question, do you actually use your cord the transfer data from your phone or tablet? Personally I never use the cord on my Galaxy Tab, It easier to use Wi-Fi and a shared folder on my NAS.
the A16 chip from last year’s pro model is the USB controller. They simply aren't upgrading that chip.
Glad to know the chip from thei last year flagship phone can only handle a tech that's more than 10 years olders. Truly a marvel of technology.
No need to be rude or insulting with the blood flowing to the brain comment.
Sorry, went overboard there. I had a shitty day and i had discussion with a friend that defended apple like his life depended on it and just dropped the "you just can't afford it argument". That plus, my hate toward apple for being the origin of every shitty decision on the phone market like no replaceable battery ,no earphones with the phone, forcing Bluetooth earphones...etc
An honest question, do you actually use your cord the transfer data from your phone or tablet? Personally I never use the cord on my Galaxy Tab, It easier to use Wi-Fi and a shared folder on my NAS.
Absolutely. Everyone i know does.
Ahh. Totally understand that kind of day man. Truly I do and what an ASS for making that kind of comment. That can not be defended in any way. Sorry that kind of crap got dumped on you today.
Yeah the lightning cable only having USB2 speeds sucked since it was never upgraded.
I completely agree with your assessment of the “innovations”. I remember the conference they got ride of the 3.5 mm headphone Jack and they said “the courage” to do something bold. Bwahahaha. It just means everyone needed to buy an adapter for the accessories.
In terms of using the cord I guess I am the minority then. Sorry for assuming the other way around.
In terms of using the cord I guess I am the minority
I think you're probably in the majority, just maybe not people you run into on Lemmy.
I personally don't have any family members who ever transfer data with a cable from their phone that I know of. Even at work, I would say only a minority do (although the age demographic is skewed older, so just understanding the phone itself is a big deal).
Also if you google number of people who use physical connectors to backup data, you get a flood of results asking if it's even possible lol
I don't think it's fair to compare UWB and USB 2.
One is already an old ass standard. I don't even know what devices aren't USB 3 anymore. You actively have to go out of your way to be a dick and downgrade your phone to USB 2.0
Not to mention the price difference is literally negligible.
Apple is just being assholes here. They already downgrade the non pro by removing cameras and whatnot. Touching the USB speed is a special kind of fuck you.
They didn’t downgrade anything…
iPhones have the USB controller as part of the SoC. Not a separate controller like the iPads or laptops. They don’t have the space for it.
The non pro this year is using last years pro chip which didn’t have a USB 3 controller on it. For the non pro they are repinning the port to USB c to repurpose the controller on the chip. But they physically cant add USB 3 to it.
They also never removed cameras from the non pro model either. Idk where you pulled that from. The XS and XS Max both only had two cameras, and when they went to the iPhone/iPhone Pro model with the 11, the non pro still had two and they added a third for the pro.
The processor in de iPhone 15 doesn’t support 3.0 speeds. The one in de pro (different proc) does. The cable of the pro doesn’t support 3.0 speeds. But neither do the cables that come with other brand phones.
Companies are dicks. Or something…
At apple scale I wouldn't be surprised to hear that giving everyone the USB 3 chip would reduce overall cost, or that apple is doing the crippling in software or firmware.
I agree the comparison between the two in terms of use is not correct or fair even. It was more of a comparison of the chips being included on the phone. I clearly did not do a good job explaining that. I assumed most people would have understood that the A17 pro chip is what is the upgrade and is the controller for the USB vs the A16 that is last years model.
In a computer the price may be negligible but in a phone is the entire architecture of the chip so its not negligible. I don't think they are being assholes as much as not spending shit tons of money to redesign and manufacture new processors for the phone when they have old stock that can be used.
Its a similar model that a lot of companies do, take last years best chip and put it in this years second tier device. I am not saying its great for consumers I am just saying its what is done. Not upgrading a chip is not the same as downgrading it.
USB 3 actually has flaws that make some devices functionally useless with USB 3 devices around.
USB 3 notoriously emits noise in the 2.4ghz radio spectrum, requiring extra precautions and development cost in order to reduce the effect.
This is often why 2.4ghz mouse and keyboards specifically require USB 2.0 connections.
I'm not saying that's why Apple did it, but it isn't a solved problem in the least and USB isn't just a no-thought upgrade.
This isn’t that different than the Galaxy note 20 not having ultra wide band but the Ultra version does.
Are we considering that UWB is as prominent as USB and you'll be using it almost daily with a multitude of devices?
No, that's a fair point. The Ultra Wide Band is not the same in terms of use and known like USB is. My comparison was meant to be of the chips on the phone. People are arguing that apple is "downgrading" to USB 2.0 but in reality they just aren't upgrading the A16 chip that is the USB controller. This is similar to the Galaxy Note 20 not having the upgraded chip like the Galaxy Note 20 Ultra. There may be other comparisons that would be more accurate but I remembered this one specifically when I was looking to upgrade Galaxy.
I get the point you're trying to make, and while it's not a 1:1 correlation, some of the responses you're getting indicate that non-Apple users can be just as fervent in their views as what would be called "fanboys".
I would like to think there is some middle ground here, with Apple having to modify their production timelines to comply with EU mandates, but still keeping in line with past hardware releases. That is to say - yes it sucks that non-Pro models will not have all the latest features, but this is pretty much consistent with the past few production releases.
Exactly I can’t remember the last time I transferred anything to my phone via a cable. Just nice to have one cord for charging.
UWB is 2019 technology which has a very very limited use and even more limited range. USB 2.0 predates iPhones by 4 years and USB3.0 is at this point 15 years old. You've been sold polished turd at premium prices and everyone is now stuck with their mouths full defending the move when it reality it's last years pro hardware shoved into this year's "new" device with USB type C hacked in to avoid EU ban.
This has nothing to do with when people last transferred files from their devices or what you like or what you think everyone else will need. This is the case of Apple selling you wheelbarrow at the price of a car and people saying it goes fast downhill and they never wanted to go uphill anyway.
Really apple? And they did all that mother nature bullshit with octavia spencer while it was europe who forced them to use a universal connector and stop polluting the world with useless pathetic cables
A $5 Pen drive transfers data faster. Some day, Apple will be able to figure how to do this in a multi hundred dollar phone. Need more MBAs.
The fact that the Pro (or any device) supports a newer USB protocol doesn't necessarily mean that it will be able to take advantage of the full speed. It might just be as slow as the non Pro with USB 2.0.
iPhone 15 Pro tech specs page: “USB 3 (up to 10Gb/s)” with a footnote that says “USB 3 cable with 10Gb/s speed required.”
A regular need for high-speed data transfers is legitimately a “pro” use case. You need the Pro model and you need to buy a thick, stiff high-speed cable.
I'm pretty certain that the USB IF decided to use the max possible Gbps as the cable rating, rather than the mess that was
USB 3.0 USB 3.1 USB 3.1 (Gen 1) USB 3.1 (Gen 2) ...
So it's more likely apple are just being specific in the type of cable you need.
The pro can stream a 4k60 ProRes video to an external drive via the usbc port. Idk what kind of bandwidth that uses. But should give some clue as to the actual speed capable with the port.
Also, onboard storage is limited to 4k30 ProRes, possibly indicating the speed of built in storage.
The only people who need the USB 3 transfer speeds are going to be Pro users. For everyone else, it doesn't matter.
What? Do you realize how insanely slow USB 2 is? Good luck transferring even a tiny ass video. I don't think you need to be a pro user to want to transfer some media from your phone and not take all day..
Most people using Apple devices don’t transfer media via cord anymore. The average user only uses the cloud for those things.
I’ve had an iPhone for the last 10 years and can count on one hand the amount of times I’ve needed to use a cable instead of iCloud/Dropbox/other file share service.
Transfering video via cord is actually apples suggested way of sending full res videos to android phones because Apple is too lazy and monopolous to adopt RCS.
RCS is also a google monopoly. Can’t call out Apple for being a monopoly without also applying the same standard to google. RCS is technically open, but in order to work they require googles servers.
I just send video over Dropbox if I want to share full res. But that is the first legitimate use I’ve seen.
What's to stop apple from using their own servers in accordance with the published specs from the GSMA, the industry nonprofit that started and steers the project by committee? Im not putting it past google to be a monopoly either, but I can't find any info that suggests apple is being shut out of doing it themselves. ATT has their own implementation away from googles RCS servers, or at least used to.
RCS is older than iMessage yet was still a total mess of compatibility just two years ago. E2EE isn’t part of the spec, but something Google tacked on to their implementation. Google has an abysmal track record for supporting chat services. So why should apple adapt to them again? Meanwhile Apple created a seamless experience for iPhone users and has been supporting it for a decade now.
They can, but why would they? RCS is essentially googles standard, it’s just more open than Apples equivalent.
For the most part Apple and Apple users just don’t care. iMessage works for most everyone, and for texting non-Apple users a 3rd party app is used.
It’s not impossible that it happens, but it’s only going to happen once their hand is forced.
So then the answer isn't "its a google monopoly" its 'google choose to work with the nonprofit and we didn't'. Im sure the 1200 company strong industry nonprofit would have loved to have apple at the table for a collaborative development on an open standard. They've done it before with usb c, they chose not to. If anything google would be asserting monopoly over other people who choose to provide RCS services, not anyone that chooses not to. I get it though, if I was Apple I'd be terrified of having to compete with googles net infrastructure, they would lose unless they got amazon on their team.
Shit, the only place I even plug my phone into now is my car because I was too dumb to wait a few months for the refresh that came with wireless CarPlay.
I use MagSafe at home for all of my charging, and airdrop/airplay for pretty much everything else that isn’t synced to iCloud.
I’ve thought about it. I haven’t decided how long I’m keeping this car though. The practical mind in me says keep it until the wheels fall off.
The enthusiast in me really wants a dark horse Mustang though lol.
And wired CarPlay works for me. Wireless would be nice but it’s not a necessity for me, especially given that that dongle would be useless to me if I do change cars here soon anyway.
I’ve looked around at the wireless CarPlay adapters, the consensus seems to be that to get one without any significant latency and operates as close to native wireless CarPlay, it’s gonna be in the $1-200 range too. That’s a decent amount for something I might only use for a few months.
Apple has been pushing users away from transferring data over cable for years anyway. Most users will sync files over wifi.
Annoying, as that should be the users choice, but I doubt the average iPhone user will even notice. Iirc the lightning connector was also limited to USB 2.0 speeds and only some particular power users ever complained about that.
It's not that slow, how'd you think I transferred stuff off a CompactFlash card with raw files off my DSLR before USB 3.0? I'd regularly dump several GBs worth of files out after a shoot. It'd take a few minutes but it's not the end of the world.
The non pro phones don’t have the RAW photo and video that the pro phones do.
RAW takes up a massive amount more space per photo and video than normal compressed images.
Also, I don’t know anyone with an iPhone that doesn’t just automatically back their photos up to iCloud anyway, meaning that all of their non RAW photos and videos are constantly transferred throughout the day to iCloud. The only people I do know that transfer things over cable are the ones that actually use the ProRes and ProRAW photos and video.
This somewhat makes sense in that ra w media is higher volume in terms of data. But lossy compressed images and video can still be high data-volume even if they are not raw.
The aspect that is missing from this discussion is how much it would actually cost Apple to include high wired data transfer speeds in non pro models and whether non pro models cost enough to justify including this feature even if a small fraction of users use it.
As an addendum I will share my opinion that even pro model users are not gonna use wired transfer 99.99% of the time. I feel Apple is doing this to fabricate a separation between pro and non-pro models plus boosting their bottom line. Sadly there are a bunch of people in this thread that are uncritically defending a trillion dollar corporation for reasons I cannot fathom. This is not really a topic that I'm passionate about so I'm not gonna engage in this any further.
It will likely come to the non pro here in a couple of years at most.
The iPads that have thunderbolt and usb3 use a separate physical usb controller for those speeds. The iPhone doesn’t have the space for that so they handle on the chip itself.
The non pro 15 is using the A16 from last year’s pro model that only supports usb 2. The pro this year has the A17 pro chip that supports it.
I suspect that next year when we get the rumored “ultra” iPhone, it will have an even beefier A18 Pro chip that will support thunderbolt 4 like the iPad Pro does with 40 gig, and the non pro iPhone will get the A17 which will handle base usb3 speed like the iPad Air does.
iPhone strange speeds are >1GB/s, or >8 Gbit/s. WiFi is nowhere close in practice, but USB 3.0 is (recent versions are much faster).
If they use their phone for it's internet connection and need to send large amounts of data, like after a photo shoot.
So, how do you sell this to a regular user? We’re probably getting new phones in this round and I want the Pro but still trying to sell that choice. My kid’s Mom has never used the data connector so how can I sell her on that as one of the features she wants?
Note on our weird situation but we have two teens and our pattern is to buy new, and give our 2-4 year old phones to the kids. For this to work, we really need to have identical phone models
I feel like not many people actually use the data port on their phones anymore, I know I haven't used my android USB port for anything other than fast charging for I feel like 10 years. Do you even use the data connector on your phone?
I use it. I plug my phone into a dock and use it in desktop mode on occasion. I actually have an old phone running an FTP server with an external hard drive connected.
I can't even remember the last time I used my phones port for data, especially anything needing 3.0 speeds. if someone uses their phone for something that needs those speeds they're probably getting the Pro anyway
I know it sounds awful but on the other hand Linus explains why it's like that in this video https://youtu.be/7KuLMe6KSVQ?si=DAdNH3JlZ4HShIYZ
Not trying to justify it, just it's good to know why.
Frankly, who even uses the USB port on their phone for data transfers unless it's an emergency? I just stream media from my NAS using Navidrome and Jellyfin, use Syncthing to back up my photos and sync files I need, and mount the SMB shares I need to access. The eMMC and SD cards are slower than USB 3 speeds, anyway. Most SD cards don't even max out USB 2.
The only sensible real life use case for USB 3 for phones would be external monitors.
Why would any average person use a usb cable for data transfer when they can just use this specialist equipment that takes more know-how than the average user has to not only spec but build and configure too. Something that most people have never even heard of. People that in most cases barely know how to use their phones or a computer.
Search me... i cant think of any reason whatsoever for that.
People must be crazy.
who even uses the USB port on their phone for data transfers
If far easier to manage files on the phone, be it upload/download/move/delete with a computer than it is fiddling with whatever shitty file manager on the phone.
I just stream media from my NAS using Navidrome and Jellyfin, use Syncthing to back up my photos and sync files
Going to venture a large portion of mobile device users don't use any of that, or know what any of that is.
What I don't get, is why you're being an apologist for Apple?
What I don’t get, is why you’re being an apologist for Apple?
I fucking hate Apple, their walled garden and questionable engineering practices. But USB port speed is the last of the reasons to hate them. I really don't give a shit about whether the USB-C port on my phone is USB 2 or 3 or whatever. Be it "normies" or "techies", I can't recall anyone in my social circle who uses the port on the phone for anything other than charging. Cloud storage, whether self-hosted or by some big company, is the norm and way more convenient. Especially considering that properly set up, everything is backed up and synced in real time automagically.
I never understood why some people take one comment of "I don't agree with that criticism" and think you are some diehard fanboy? I don't like Apple, I don't like Tesla or Elon Musk, but sometimes I disagree with some criticism they get and basically every single time someone thinks I must be a loyal fan.
I'm sure there are those who will or could make great use of USB3 speeds, but I think like 99% of the users won't notice the difference because they just don't use it. I know I've never used USB for data transfer in my last couple Android phones, I only use it for charging and even that is greatly reduced since I mainly use wireless charging now.
Transferring large amounts of 4K ProRes video off the phone and onto a computer. But someone who’s seriously doing that is buying the Pro anyways and that’s faster
Well, not an iPhone user myself, but I use the port because it just gets to be straightforward.
I can appreciate the self hosting of Jellyfin, but then I'm at a place in the mountains without adequate cell signal nor other decent internet. One day I was doing the Jellyfin thing then of course my music stops. Turns out there was an outage near my home.
It dawned on me that I went through a lot of trouble to have my media remotely accessible, when plugging into USB let me just dump the files and the on-device media players were really good at handling it. Besides, the latency on seeking the media was sooooo much better than streaming it (the streaming seek latency isn't bad, but it isn't instant either).
Fair point about perhaps not needing USB 3 speeds, but USB 3 has been a thing for 14 years now. Phones that cost half as much as the iPhone 15 toss in USB 3 speeds without a thought. Sure, there are budget Android type-c that only have 2.0, but any phone that costs anywhere near as much as the iPhone seems to have USB 3 speeds on the port.
It feels really stupid having the industries longest support length and highest resell value.
That's like saying foot fungus is a great investment because it's hard to get rid of. Also you conveniently left off that longest support is often required because of cost cutting measures Apple loves to do. How many product recalls were there? And even then they sometimes make them so that no one fits the criteria.
It’s not hard to get rid of an iPhone at all. I could sell the device in my hand easily if I wanted to.
What are you even talking about? Cost cutting makes them support a phone longer? Supporting a phone longer costs them more money. Literally the antithesis of your claim.
There were 0 product recalls. You may be thinking of Samsung who recalled the Note 7 for exploding. The iPhone 4 antenna design flaw was known inside the retail return window and anyone could have returned it for a full refund. They otherwise offered a free case to everyone who elected to keep the phone (myself included). The first line of Samsung Galaxy GSM phones had a similar flaw if you cupped the bottom rear of the phone; the Vibrant model on T-mobile had an “ass” that stuck out that was easier to cause total network drop on then my iPhone 4 on AT&T, but Samsung did not offer a free case or mitigation.
All you have to do is go to Apple site and see number of recall programs currently active. The fact you don't know about them or you are lying says a lot. But zero is not even close. Pretty much every laptop generation had an issue that had to be addressed one way or another. iPhones were a bit better but still frequent.
On another note if you want to finger point at any company for making a mistake, Samsung isn't one. Number of affected Note7 devices was first of all small but even so Samsung gave EVERYONE new S7 Edge as a replacement for Note7. As opposed to Apple who sold refurbished devices to users as a part of replacement program.
My joke was that extended service programs were there as a result of poor quality... And yes it does cost them more to provide support but then again class action lawsuit costs more.
Also, it's extremely ironic that Apple currently has recall program for MacBook Pro due to batteries posing fire risk, while you point out how Samsung was bad for risky batteries and claiming Apple had 0 recalls. You fanboys are a joke.
Ok, I misunderstood. I thought you were implying a much more narrow definition. Samsung has an extensive list of recalls too. Most tech companies do, or at least should. Many get away with flat out ignoring major issues. This is a sign of companies making things right, not a showing of how many problems they have. Apple has way more issues than this, as does Google (my phone probably couldn’t call 911 for several days. Glad I didn’t find out for sure). Samsung has had actually dangerous recalls. They have a line of Nvme drives that are all defective and they refuse to recall them. Western digital / sandisk has several too.
I’m not going to allow you to compare a literal exploading phone to anything else. That’s absurd and you should be embarrassed to bring that up.
Warranty replacements are almost always refurbished from every manufacturer. Refurbished Apple products typically have all new external parts for the record. MacBooks don’t for the record, but I’ve personally purchased refurbished iPads, iPhones, and apple TVs and they are indistinguishable from new visually. Samsung has a business program that does something similar. I’m not aware of they do this on the consumer level.
Your joke doesn’t make sense. They aren’t extending support because they screwed something up. They support all iPhones longer than Android makers. Only just recently are a few starting to approach similar longevity.
Posing a fire risk is different than multiple actual publicized incidents of Note 7s blowing up to the point where they are banned on airplanes. The vast majority of recalls are preventative. Samsung screwed the Note 7 up twice. Their initial fix didn’t work and then they scrapped the entire phone. It would have killed any other Android maker.
I'd wager that owning an iPhone is cheaper than a Samsung Galaxy or likely any premium Android.
An iPhone is typically getting 6 years of iOS versions, plus an additional 1-2 years of security updates. For instance, the iPhone X, announced in Fall 2017 was on latest iOS until iOS 17 comes in this month. iPhone 6S, released in Sep 2015, is still getting security updates.
If you are someone who runs their phone into the ground until the end of security updates, iPhone wins hands down. If you are someone who wants the latest and greatest, iPhone hold resale value like no other and its not even close.
