https://www.nytimes.com/2023/08/15/us/houston-texas-revenge-porn.html
A jury ruled in favor of a Texas woman who said her ex-boyfriend had psychologically and sexually abused her by sharing intimate images of her online without her consent.
Man fuck these comments. He explicitly said he wanted to ruin the rest of her life. He intentionally posted them with her full name and address, endangering her. And to ruin her chance at getting/keeping a job. Dude does deserve to have his wages garnished for the rest of his life, at least there's a cap on UNLIKE WHAT HE TRIED TO DO TO HER!
Most of the disgusting comments are at least being criticized directly. Can’t silence the fuckheads, but you can appreciate other people dunking on them, at least
Dude does deserve to have his wages garnished for the rest of his life
I agree.
However, if he made 100k a year and had to pay all of that, his life would have to last 12 million years. Just seems like some of the maths here is a bit off. But maybe I just don't understand the American justice system.
I mean we do multiple life sentences or life + so many years so I don't see why the same logic wouldn't apply when the penalty is monetary. It's a super high number to ensure he's paying the rest of his life, even if he suddenly comes into a bunch of money. It's intended as a warning.
I mean how much money can you put on the price of someone's life, safety, or missed future potential earnings? I think it was just a huge number to "ruin the rest of his life" as he attempted to do.
For example, the McDonald's coffee lawsuit. The coffee was so hot it melted that lady's skin together. And this was an ongoing issue that McDonald's had been warned of several times and didn't listen. So while the lady was just trying to get her medical costs covered, the jury awarded an additional $2.7m in punitive damages because McDonald's didn't listen. Punitive damages are literally money as punishment.
It’s a super high number to ensure he’s paying the rest of his life, even if he suddenly comes into a bunch of money. It’s intended as a warning.
Yes, I get that. Still I find it a very strange, even macabre. I made the point in a couple of other comments, but got no useful replies so far.
It seems to me this guy was basically convicted to living at "minimum wage" or at least some minimum that can't be taken from him, so he can cover his basic needs.
So he is convicted to being poor. Nothing else. But, like there is actual poor people with a very similar standard of living, that did nothing wrong. It just doesn't seem fair. How shitty must it be, as a poor person, that your neighbour is there only because he was convited to have your shitty live?
Also, what if he was already super poor before that and he won't come into any fortune. What money are you even gonna take from him? Does that mean if you're already poor you can just publish revengeporn, because what are they gonna take from you?
Like, if you're poor ... what is the "warning"? That they make sure you gonna be poor forever? Chances are that would be the case anyway.
Also, what incentive does this guy now have to actually contribute to society by doing anything more than the minimum he needs to afford?
Would the situation be any materially different if he had been convicted for $100.000, short of winning the lottery or inheriting a large sum? The fact that he made it his mission to ruin an ex's life then didn't show up to court tells me he's not exactly the kind to have a legal high-paying job. Regardless of the exact monetary amount the consequences would have been the exact same, the difference is purely symbolic.
The American Justice System is broken, yes, but this particular case is hardly the best example of it. As an outsider looking in, I find it more troubling that you still have the death penalty, the whole "plead guilty or don't get fair representation from your public defender" thing, over-incarceration, for-profit prisons, etc.
I don't disagree. Income inequality is an overarching issue in the US. As is charging monetary damages that will never be paid out. My mom was injured in a car accident by someone driving under the influence, and she had to cover all her medical bills out of pocket despite winning in court because the dude wasn't even working and had no money to garnish.
I was more talking about how it fits in with the current system, as flawed as it may be. I don't have a good solution aside from overhauling the massive income inequality in this country. People working minimum wage jobs (which are usually jobs we need for society to function!) should not be living the same lifestyle as this dude.
So why no Prison for this dude? Like, I don't want to sound like the typical anti-US European, but you send so many people to prison! The most in the world, by capita.
He deserves a couple of years and she deserves a reasonable amount of money that this guy can actually cough up. And then maybe things can move on.
Then again, from popular media I'm made to believe that US prisons are actually quite horrid, so maybe you don't deserve that easily.
I just have the cynical feeling this guy actually got off lightly and the big number is just there to make for big media coverage with no real meaning.
How shitty must it be, as a poor person, that your neighbour is there only because he was convited to have your shitty live?
Speaking as a poor person who learned why he is poor like me: fuck this guy. He deserved it. Literally tried to ruin her life and you expect us to feel bad he got punished for it? Like please.
Sounds like he was charged in absentia, so more symbolic than anything, sadly. I hope she gets some money though.
Yeah. Sadly, the quote “If you owe the bank a thousand dollars, it’s your problem; if you owe them a billion, it’s their problem” applies here too. Hopefully she bleeds him dry and maybe some prison time too.
His wages will be garnished forever. He's been sentenced to destitution forever. He'd be better off just leaving the country.
I'm hoping he's a US citizen so he won't be able to avoid paying US taxes anywhere he goes without also getting a new identity and going into permanent hiding. As long as his life is destroyed far more comprehensively than his attempt to destroy hers, I'm happy.
Well done that jury. This is not just about a very large settlement, it's a very newsworthy settlement. It's impossible to measure the impact on crimes that don't happen but I reckon there will be a fair few potential perpetrators of this sort of crime who might just manage to get a fucking grip because of this. And a fair few victims who find a way to exact an entirely justified revenge on those who fail to grow the fuck up anyway.
well if he was to leave the US and never return there's very little risk in not paying the bills. it's likely little would happen if you came back to visit for the holidays, either
I thought the US was pretty hot on chasing non-resident citizens for their taxes (and presumably garnished wages)?
I'm not going to enforce it. It's entirely possible that the US givt does not enforce it despite requiring it. But they usually only ignore taxes for very rich people, who can dodge them anyway, so I'd expect them to enforce it?
He would have been better off not trying to ruin her life and put her directly in harms way.
Putting up naked pictures of someone with their name and address? This is a man who wanted her raped or dead.
Fuck your sympathy for him having consequences for his own actions.
I wouldn't say he is sentenced to destitution. Wage garnishment is capped at 25% of disposable income. And you keep a minimum of 217.5 per week (30 hours of minimum wage a week).
A 25% pay cut certainly hurts but depending on his income he could still have a decent life.
The amount is ridiculous but even a more reasonable sentence around 500k-5mil would probably not change anything for his situation. Most people wouldn't pay that off in their lifetime at 25% of income.
Iirc the 25% cap really only ends up applying if you have more than one active garnishment. Individual garnishments are generally 10% of gross. Maybe there are exceptions where one can go up to the full 25% of disposable, but it's rarely the case.
Hardly - he has an SSN. Any job that pays taxes he’ll be garnished. Even if he manages to hide his identity with a fake ssn, his life as it was is ruined. Definitely a form of justice considering he literally was trying to ruin her life through these actions.
Probably $100 per month depending on his salary.
It's a bit like those cases where a defendant gets 54 life sentences + 100 years. Only in America.
Agreed. I'm guessing it's written in law something like $100,000 per download or something, and it got downloaded a lot.
It financially ruins him for life and sends a strong message though, which is presumably the point.
The problem is not the he got a laughably high fine, it's that the others don't. I think something in the hundreds of thousands would be more appropriate for a private individual. I expect an appeal to reign that in some, if filed.
Dude doesn't sound like the kind of guy who has $200 million. Or could ever earn it in a lifetime.
This is effectively making him pay for it, quite literally, for the rest of his life. Imo that sounds like a more severe punishment than if he were actually rich enough to pay all at once and just end it early.
Who knows, with inflation the way it is, maybe it'll be $200M for a Big Mac by the time he retires. ;)
$200 million for past and future mental anguish and $1 billion in punitive damages
NB: Texas caps punitive damages to $750k.
Yep. And that’s rough. BigOilCorp 750k is lunch money. So that’s just shit.
Sure it’ll crush this guy though…
So what's the point of such a high number that literally only a handful of people could actually pay? Headlines?
Exactly, judge wanted to make a point.
This makes it national news.
TBF, I wouldn't be surprised if a large percentage of people would of considered doing what he did, a "dick move" or "petty" but not a serious crime. This serves as a wake up call.
As a german, I always find amusing when americans are scared of not being able to find a job because they have nude photos online. Meanwhile I have practically seen all of my colleagues/family naked either at the job showers, sauna or nudist parks and beaches.
Special interest groups for the U.S. porn industry propagating shame on the amateurs to boost professional porn sales. 😋
German here too. I have no idea why, but I'd find that so incredibly weird. I guess I grew up in a very prude family. I'd love to be more open towards nudity because why the fuck not, there's nothing inherently sexual or weird about naked people, but I really struggle with that
No the point is the choice to be seen nude. Plenty of people in the US are quite comfortable being seen nude, but you're correct that most people don't want that. I'm pretty sure if you took a camera into a sauna in Germany, and posted the pictures online, the subjects of your photos would be upset about it.
How exactly is it a deterrent?
I mean, the guy clear doesn't have or will ever have $1.2 Billion or anything even close. So clear he won't actually be paying almost all of this. It's like threatening to take something away you don't have in the firstplace?
So what is the actual punishment then?
What if he is already poor and just getting by. You literally might just be taking pennies from him.
I guess it's a form of punishment that favours the poor for a change?
Right? Like, that's just how many people get by anyway. That seems like a shitty punishment.
When I did garnishments, sometimes I would calculate literal pennies for their checks.
They would get more interest in what they owed than they paid those weeks.
Although he may not be able to pay 1.2 bil in damages, he surely can and will give away a lot of his paycheck to her. It's like alimony turned up to eleven.
And that is it? Like you don't go to prison for failing to pay your fines?
So he basically got sentenced to living on minimum wage for life? That doesn't sound that bad and certainly makes the 1.2 billion number quite pointless.
Since he essentially threatened her with harrassment for life I'd say it's a fair trade.
He fucked around and found out.
Is it though?
From what I understand he now just has to live at like the existential minimum. Sure that suck ... but there is plenty of people are already living on that and they didn't do anything. How is that fair?
Also, if he actually just accepts his faith now and only earns enough money to just get by with as little as possible, he couldn't pay anything at all.
What is wrong with prison? I thought you Americans loved putting people on there, why not this guy?
He's also now infamous just like he threatened to make his ex. Every time anyone Googles him, this is what will come up. It is kind of fitting in that way.
As for why not prison, it's hard to put people in jail for something like this. I assume that's the reason why this went to civil court rather than the criminal court.
He posted their private sex photos on Dropbox and sent links to her friends, family and employer.
The hell he deserves anything less than living in poverty for a very long time.
You seriously see nothing wrong with forcing people into poverty as the only punishment when you have actual people living in poverty? How do you not see how fucked up that is?
Like, what if he was already dead poor? What would be the punishment then?
Also, if that really is the only punishemnt ... that basically just means the middle class get 1 free crime before they are downgraded to the lowest poor tier.
Im pretty sure he can file for bankruptcy. Everything he owns will be gone but he can start fresh.
at what he likely will be able to afford, he can pay her a thousand per month and he'll only be paying until the entire galaxy has made a full rotation, a full 100.000 years.
I get the point, but this 1.2 billion is just ridiculous.
Yes, this guy is an asshole, yes he needs to be punished, yes he needs to get punched in the dick for all I care but... In reality, worst case, she will likely suffer no more negative effects of this after 5 years whereas this dude can effectively kill himself because even if he wins 20 lotteries in a row, he still won't be able to get rid of this one. Punishment doesn't fit the crime here.
Look, I get that she was wronged, but unless the defendant is Google or Microsoft, leveling damages like this is egregious and absurd.
They may have well awarded 150 billion dollars worth of damages. There's no way it'll ever be paid so what's the goal here? Showcase an astronomical amount as a flex?
Yes, it is a flex. It's an expression of zero tolerance for the kind of egregious shit this turkey was pulling.
The US system seems to use symbolic numbers, eg 200 years in jail for multiple murdering etc, pretty regularly. I don't see how this is any different.
You've got a point. America greatly prefers superfluous symbolism to sensible logic.
Yes, kind of like sentencing somebody to hundreds or years or multiple lifetimes for mass murder.
The point is not really the money. The point is the headline and the fact that there are remedies for when you can't pay a judgement. Like others said, his wages will be garnished forever. And this is one of the largest civil judgements ever. That plus the salacious nature means that anytime this guy's name is searched for, it will be beside this. It won't leave him.
Until we get better laws for things like revenge porn where there are actual criminal penalties, this is probably the best we can do.
Oh for fucks sakes. We have people who were wrongly imprisoned and spent decades in jail and they get a couple of hundred Gs and this lady is awarded $1.2B because someone saw her hoo-ha. We really have fucked up morals. The award amount is so obnoxious that I'm almost glad she'll never see a dime of it. This is just a mockery of justice.
Just because we can do better in one department doesn't mean it's bad we're doing good in another department.
I think it's an absurd ruling as well, but I don't feel bad for the douchebag in question. I don't really understand how they came up with the numbers. 1 billion in punitive damages? Based on what? Crazy.
But I'm fine with the guy being financially ruined for it. He deserves that much.
He posted her real name and address along with those videos and pics of her, which is basically opening her up to being attacked. He also threatened her job prospects and threatened to continue harassing her for the rest of her life. I agree that there should be more paid out to wrongly imprisoned people, but this was more than just having her hoo-ha shown.
Dieselgate cost VW $15B which affected literally millions of people on a global scale over over a decade of gaming emissions standards.
The Enron accounting scandal cost $7B and involved one of the richest corporations in the nation.
The Gulf of Mexico oil spill cost BP $20B and caused irreparable damage to the environment down there.
But yeah, having your pics posted online and one's address leaked is SURELY on a similar level to these other crimes. Oh, definitely! /s
That doesn't mean this case is no big deal. Poor woman.
I do agree that the large amount is silly because the guy is probably not a billionaire. Hopefully they will increase punishments for corporations and rich people-- oh wait, they won't. That's fucked up, but not related to this case
You can call out the hypocrisy without minimizing her suffering. "They saw your bits, so what" is a ridiculous response to having your private sex videos shared with everyone you know
She was awarded 200 mil with the 1B in punitive damages, which the state caps at 750k.
So 200.75 mil total in the end.
200 mil is still ridiculous, so your point still stands ¯\_ (ツ) _/¯
