https://www.huffpost.com/entry/trump-russia-attack-nato-allies_n_65c7e443e4b069b665dfb762
"You gotta pay your bills," said the former president notorious for not paying his own bills.
There's also a 1:1 probability that you're a sociopath, mentally unstable, brainwashed, legitimately stupid, or willfully ignorant.
No. You're underestimating the legitimate ignorance of the electorate. Give this comment a read.
Thats a great read, and echoes what ive been seeing at my own workplace. Those who even remotely follow news (outside of Faux News) are all voting biden. Those who dont, hear that bidens old, that hes out of touch, and want trump to win out of spite for how much they hate the political climate.
That whole, "vote for trump or abstain to stick it to the man" thing is trending like nothing else. Even here on Lemmy, but esp on reddit.
TALK TO THE PPL IN UR LIFE, NOW!
https://midwest.social/comment/7013586
Just follow this comment chain.
And im banned from the sub for this. Fucking terrifying shit if ur at all into democracy or oopsed to fascism.
Please spread word of this happening. On reddit this shit is far far more widespread. There, leftist subs that once prided themselves on never banning anyone will happily ban anyone who says that not voting for biden is playing right into fascist hands, even if said comment generates positive feedback!
Yup my local magat has no idea that any trials happened for the Jan 6 insurrectionists. He thinks Biden personally sent them to jail without trial.
When I showed him the stats for guilty pleas and convictions he changed the subject to Hunter’s problems.
I mean, there’s a solution. Feel free to help us all out. I’ll donate to your go fund me defense fund.
I hear you, but I'm just not sure how spitting into his McDonald's hamberders keeps him from becoming President.
He might get some of your healthy bacteria that could influence his gut health and turn him around now that he doesn't have to deal with terrible butt problems
Yeah, in an ideal world, the next and last thing I would hear about trump is Obituary: Donald (tiny hands) Trump, the worst President in history passed away today after rolling over in his sleep and suffocating on his pillow. He was unable to roll back due to diet and exercise history. His family has not picked up the body due to the willing members being incarcerated.
Real people will die if he becomes POTUS again and yet America minces words about what kind of ideology he represents. He better hope the mob doesn't ever get their hands on him.
I don't know if by "mob" you mean organized crime or dipshit Jan 6 traitors, but either way, he's leading it.
The man organized an insurrection and it was televised. He won’t be held accountable for this either.
You must be referring to the peaceful tour in which people were bludgeoned, trespassed, and shot in an attempt to stop the certification of a democratic election. Please don't exaggerate!! (:
Anyone wondering why the rest of the world has begun taking the US less and less seriously and has begun distancing themselves from any decisions we make, you can thank this incompetent orange retard for the ludicrous amount of damage he did to the US's soft power.
This literally sounds like a mob guy coming into a store and "suggesting" that you need to pay "protection money" or else something bad may happen...
The only time in the history of NATO that article 5 was invoked was on September 12, 2001.
NATO countries sent soldiers to Afghanistan in support of the US. A two decades long war. I'm personally from a NATO country and have two family members that have PTSD because my country honored the agreement and supported the US after it was attacked.
The US has never engaged in a war to support any NATO members. NATO members have engaged in a war to support the US.
Recruitment numbers are down in my country in large part because of how the war in Afghanistan turned out. That was in large part due to the US going on a little side adventure into Iraq. Because of this, even though my country is purchasing equipment from the US defense Industrial complex (which if we're being real, is what the goal is) we don't have enough military personnel to operate that equipment.
So with all that, shitheads in the US complain about my countries "not pulling their weight". We've been sending our people to fight in a US war for two fucking decades because that's what allies do, but then shitheads in the US don't care about that, they only care about how much money is coming from NATO to the US defense industrial complex? It's craven.
And Russia propaganda and election interference is happening in every NATO country. For the same reason that there are many in the US don't think the US should support Ukraine, there's many people in other NATO countries that think the same because of the same Russian propaganda effort. Instead of being hyper-focused on the revenues of Lockheed Martin and Raytheon, maybe think a little more about who the real enemy.
While this is very obvious just putin expressing his control over the us republican party:
And there are a lot more "not support" situations like that. In large part because WW1 taught humanity about the dangers of... actually being in military agreements. WW2 and The Cold War very much demonstrated the need to have those unified fronts but there is still the fear of one flashpoint plunging the entire world into war. Hence "Oh yeah. We are buddies. Uhm... could you NOT declare war because we will totally tell you to go fuck yourself rather than help"
Which is also why actually declaring war is so rare these days. Its not a war. Its a peacekeeping operation or a conflict or whatever. So we'll pressure you to help us commit atrocities but you'll also kind of just be in the area shooting some brown people and not be at war or anything.
And, just to be clear: I think the NATO support of Ukraine is excellent. I actively wish we had done more rather than use it as a way to bleed russia dry by a thousand cuts. But putting "boots on the ground" is how you get an Iraq/Afghanistan where all nations involved are actively wishy-washy on what their actual goals are and are trying to avoid committing out of fear of triggering "a real war"
Your bullet points are listing military action that were explicitly not NATO missions.
Which is also why actually declaring war is so rare these days. Its not a war. Its a peacekeeping operation or a conflict or whatever. So we’ll pressure you to help us commit atrocities but you’ll also kind of just be in the area shooting some brown people and not be at war or anything.
No one declares war anymore because a declaration of war is going from 0 to 100 with a stroke of a pen. Probably not a good thing to be doing after the invention of nuclear weapons. Probably wasn't ever a good thing, given it made war seem like something that was legal and civilized. Atrocities have always existed in wars and entangling alliances and declarations of war represented automatic expansion of atrocities. This is now widely seen as a bad thing.
Now we generally use the concept of escalation towards war. This allows for the potential to deescalate before it becomes an all out war. Yes atrocities can occur during escalation and deescalation. But it's significantly less than the 0 to 100 scenario that was happening when declarations of war was commonplace. Look to the cities of Germany at the end of WWII if you want to see the results of an all out war in modern times. Or look at Gaza right now. Look to the cities of Japan at the end of WWII if you want to see what all out war looks like after nuclear weapons came into existence.
So no, we probably should try to avoid the all out war scenarios that declarations of war represents. Especially since we're transitioning to being a more multi-polar world, which means there will be more wars going forward.
Sometimes I like to imagine that trump is actually an elaborate honey pot, and any day now all of his supporters are going to be rounded up for being treasonous idiots too dangerous to leave unattended. But no, people really are that awful.
The guy's fool and a security threat. He should be in a cell, not on television.
I'm not entirely convinced that Trump isn't set up and supported by the Bush family so W didn't go down in history as the worst modern president ever.
Yeah I think I have heard a thing or two about something called the chilly war or something like that. Sounds delicious at first but then you read up on it and it was a lot of dick wagging but with nukes instead of dicks.
He and his co-conspirators are what gitmo was built for and where they belong. Traitor's and terrorists the lot of them.
Trump should be in prison but Gitmo should not exist. Let's not use Trump as an excuse to justify that atrocity.
I'm not going to say your wrong because your not but if we are going to continue to use it (we likely are), threat's to our republic such as insurrectionists, a place like gitmo is surely where they should be.
That's the longest run on sentence I've written in a while.
Trump is cool with enhanced interrogations. I say we let his fantasy of torturing traitors play out, and we find out what documents he stole, and what he really thinks about the 2020 election. It's really a win-win.
Quick reminder: NATO's collective defense clause, also known as Article 5, has only been triggered once. It was invoked in response to the September 11, 2001, terrorist attacks on the United States.
Reminder that Trump was happy about those attacks that day because they made his property value go up
He said that on the day.
A few hours after the towers collapsed, he decided to call into a radio station and brag. No one asked him, he just did it. And he said:
“Well, it was an amazing phone call,” Mr Trump told WWOR. “I mean, 40 Wall Street actually was the second-tallest building in downtown Manhattan. And it was actually – before the World Trade Center – was the tallest. And then when they built the World Trade Center, it became known as the second-tallest, and now it’s the tallest.”
And, like most things Trump says, it wasn't even true. It was never the second-tallest building in downtown Manhattan.
So, on 9/11, while first responders were digging through the rubble and pulling out corpses, Trump called up the biggest radio station in New York to lie about how tall his building was.
It was never the second-tallest building in downtown Manhattan.
Are you sure about that? It was once the tallest building in the world, then the second tallest (after the Chrysler Building), and (Wikipedia says so) after the 70 Pine Street was build the 2nd tallest in “Lower Manhattan”.
As the article I linked to said-
As multiple fact checks later pointed out, this was not true. The Wall Street building had not been the tallest building in lower Manhattan in the 1970s, when the Twin Towers were constructed, nor was it the tallest in the area after 2001.
Russia attacking NATO would give a significant chunk of the globe the green light to obliterate Putin.
This is likely the route to ending the war on Ukraine with the lowest loss of human life.
So... Go on Putin, try it.
The problem with this is that Russia will rather take whole world down with it than admit defeat. They don't obey the rules (and laws) of war.
Anymore. The Russians themselves did for a time. Case in point the times a russian actively prevented WW3 or rather a nuclear exchange.
So you are telling me Arkhipov and Petrov where just propaganda figures to promote the "good will" of the soviet union?
You can do that all day long, without hard facts I will not believe you, because both cases have been documented extensively and thoroughly. Ukrainian propaganda is doing a bad job, grasping at straws these days. I'm still 100% behind Ukraine, but negating everything and trying to paint anyone who isn't in line as the bad guy is straight out of the soviet and russian handbooks.
Painting Russia as the rational side who actually wants peace and the evil West as the warmongers (not just for this war) is a fairy tale and one of the main taking points of Russian propaganda. I’m not saying you’re on their side but if you parrot them without putting it into perspective, you’re doing their bidding.
I'd never paint Russia as the rational side - which is why the distinction between Russia and the Soviet Union AND the distinction between individuals is important, imho.
Ooooh right, nUcLeAr WaRfArE! Forgot about that. Yeah, we should probably just let them completely destroy Ukraine, and after they're done, feed em whichever countries they want until they've had their fill.
Anything to keep Putin placated!
Wats that?
That's the reason we need to not give Putin a free pass to commit whatever evil he wants. He'll saber rattle all day long, but he knows the second he calls that order that he's signing his own death sentence. He cares about himself above all else, so that shit ain't gonna happen regardless of how loudly they hint about it.
Had he just said that NATO countries are failing their duty as a member as they're not paying the agreed amount of money for the alliance he would actually sound sane. Most Europeans agree to that. The governments have been slacking for years, and now there is a war. Again.
Instead he talks like a lunatic. Fuck that guy.
It's not even that simple, because paying can be done with money, but you can also send troops, or have troops ready to protect other countries, send equipment, etc.
So it's not that black and white who pays what.
Also I think the biggest think Trump did to NATO for the EU, is that for the first time people actually realized the US isn't always the allie we thought. It really depends on who's president, something before Trump most people never thought about. It also really pushed the point of having an European army and other changes like that.
I don't think he's talking to NATO countries anymore than he's talking to his party.
I think he's asking Putin for help again.
I don't know that Putin really wants anything more from Trump though. He got the discord he wanted to distract the US. He got to flex on all of the world by Trump getting elected and demonstrating his spook prowess.
But, that's just my opinion, Putin has forgotten more about international politics and power than I'll likely ever know.
Feeding his base. Republicans only platform is to trigger libs. They’re like monkeys throwing shit at their fellow citizens.
I might 'encourage' someone to kick Trump square in the toad-from-mario-shaped microdicklette.
I'm sure Russia that can't even conquer Ukraine is more than capable of going to war against rest of NATO /s
This is really laughable. Trump is bitching about not paying bills? Trump? They guy who's lawyers need to sue him to force him to pay his bills? The guy who robbed money from his charities for himself? That dude?
He means that Europe got complacent with Russia, which it did, but he's not some genius for seeing that. It was a known issue and let's say that Europe has learned it's lesson. He just was typically dumpass trump and threatened his allies over small issues, instead of using diplomacy.
Now saying that he'll encourage Putin to attack Europe (good luck with that one, btw) is again stabbing his allies. He doesn't understand that America is worth shit without those allies, because of course he doesn't because he's trump. Be proud of being dumb.
And conservatives all over the world still want to install Trump as POTUS, let alone the American ones.
