the dick = la pinga, which is female
the pussy = el bollo, which is male
until next time, friends! 👋
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This is just great! Tienes nombres mil el miembro viril has to be a new saying that gets used in regular speech
Same in Mexico though in El Salvador it's referred to beating someone up if spoken as a verb. I got really confused when a Salvadorean guy was telling me he fucked another guy only to find out it was actually in the context of a fight.
Exactly! I would add that you can still use "no binario" or "no binaria" in a (somewhat) respectful manner. For instance, you can say "persona no binaria" (non binary person), "comunidad no binaria" (non binary community), because both nouns are feminine, you can use the feminine alteration of "no binario". For masculine I would go with "su género es no binario" (its gender in non binary), since gender is masculine and "su" doesn't imply any gender at all.
Again, not an expert just another fellow native Spanish speaker with a bit of a geekiness about languages.
The solution is pretty simple:
Instead just saying "soy no binario/no binaria" people have to say "soy una persona no binaria"
Many Latinos refuse to use "e" when the "o" is already neutral. Better improve your Spanish grammar than changing it.
I think the e thing sounds fucking stupid, however if that makes people happy, so be it, language is supposed to evolve over time, the e is only annoying if you actively oppose to it (or are in a position where you're not allowed to make mistakes)
agree, except "doesn't exist in the language" - if people are saying it, it exists in the language, there's no committee deciding what's "in" or "out" of Spanish (or English, for that matter).
Yes there is a committee for Spanish. It’s called the Real Academia Española. Their official mission is to ensure the stability of the Spanish language across 22 hispanophone countries. I reference them daily because I don’t speak Spanish fluently yet I live in a Spanish speaking country.
I believe that English is the largest language without any sort of "official body." In France, the Académie Française has the authority to decide what is and isn't French. I believe that similar bodies exist for German and Mandarin, as well.
Right, but as all similar such committees eventually learn, there's a pretty strict limit to what they can actually control or regulate. Mostly it's just formal written usage that can be regulated. Spoken language doesn't give a shit about anyone's notions of what's considered correct or incorrect. This is one of the foundational principles of linguistics.
This isn't correct, actually. English is the only major language that has no formal regulators of the language, and Spanish is one of the most formally regulated.
This isn't entirely true either. The adjective "binario" has to agree with the gender of what's being talked about, either the grammatical gender of the noun or the natural gender of the person. A salient example could be the noun "piloto". Just as adjectives inflect for gender so do pronouns, so you can say "el piloto" or "la piloto" depending on the natural gender of the person, and inflect adjectives accordingly. Grammatical gender and natural gender are both distict concepts that impact gender inflection in spanish.
man I have that issue but it's not (just) me being an asshole I actually just suck at remembering that people have transitioned
Best move I ever made was leaving for college and coming back with tits. That shock stuck in my friends heads
Old English used to have feminine, masculine and neuter like most of the other Germanic languages, but we lost it for various historical reasons.
Are there any spanish people? Is it based on person's gender or the following word's gender?
e.g. in Russian, "nebinarniy chelovek" means nonbinary human but in male declension because the word human itself is male, and "nebinarnaya persona" is female because the word person is female. We also have "nebimarnoye litso" where "litso" is face or a person and it's a third gender literally called soulless and beloved by police and lawyers because its dehumanizing
Interesting! It's based on the subject's gender. In spanish, human is male and person is female as well, but we don't have a third gender.
I don't even know why you'd debate this thing about the russian language, they've got more on their plate until they reach debating social issues
It's an example of a language with grammatical gender they are familiar with, so of course they use it as an example. Works the same way in most (all?) slavic languages.
It's true that gender issues are not even something that is talked about currently in Russia. But I'm just using the example from OP post to talk about linguistic features here. For me and I think most English speaking folk it might sound confusing whether Spanish grammatical gender implies person's gender and threw example in Russian where it doesn't have to - I can talk about you in male, female, or neutral gender. It only depends on which words I use and which endings they have.
I don't know why you're being down voted. As a Spanish speaker, it's a definite limitation of the language. Where is the penis on a pen, or the vagina on a pencil? Not everything needs a gender, even if you take a firm stance on the existence of non-binary people.
Most people speaking a certain language don’t view it as gender gender. They view it as grammar. They usually view it as “this word changes the end of the adjective to ‘e’ instead of ‘a’” or whatever rule your language has.
Gender in languages aren’t just, “that object seems female” or “that object seems male” because they are many rules that change the gender of the object even if it looks “manly”. For example, in Punjabi, there’s a rule where if the noun has an “ee” at the end, it will be feminine regardless of its characteristics because the sentence flows better that way in Punjabi.
Languages just have gender because it sounds easier to say/flows nicely, rarely actually because they think a certain object has an actual gender.
-A native speaker of a gender language
It's worth pointing out that linguistic gender came first. When people started talking about how humans have all these complicated different ways that we can present socially depending on context, it adopted the linguistic notion of gender.
The joke is:
Non-binary refers to people not identifying with either being exclusive male nor female.
The post shows someone asking ChatGPT what this is called in spanish.
As spanish seems to have gender for nouns, this defeats the purpose of being neither female/male.
A non binary person would be "una persona non binaria", which is a gendered word, female.
It partially makes sense. Non-binary in Spanish is gendered depending on the subject. But it is not a real gender. Person is "female", human being is "male". But they are generic words
It's an adjective so it must match the gender of the noun before it. So if you want to say non-binary person, since person is femenine, you'd say "persona no binaria". Unfortunately, however, most nouns change gender depending on the gender of the person referred to. So you can't say non-binary gardener without resorting to "made up" grammar.
I think there is a grammatical rule for it, if you refer to a group of multi-gendered subjects you use the male suffix, so "no binario" would be the correct term to use.
Well, that's more or less true, although contested politically, but it certainly doesn't help when referring to individuals.
That said, the obsession with grammatical gender in pronouns is largely an anglosphere import, and the introduction of neolanguage neutral forms to Spanish is definitely not gaining the traction it does for English speakers. It simply messes with too many words too much of the time.
However, anyone who thinks native Spanish speakers don't mess around with pronouns needs to go hang out with some young people (or, you know, some LGBTQ people of any age), because man, the amount of gender flipping and going back and forth for effect you get in colloquial Spanish is both hilarious and definitely not compatible with "pronouns are evil" anglo conservatism.
So hey, the AI got it sorta right. Remove the "gender of the person" there, and add "how you feel about it" and it's pretty spot-on.
It would still be personas no binarias. Or gente no binaria. Or seres humanos no binarios. Adjectives in Spanish must agree with the number and gender of the noun they’re describing.
Imagine if you’d asked it for a vegetarian recipe and it asked if you wanted it to have a chicken or beef base. It’s sorta like that
The joke is that someone who is non-binary doesn't identify as male or female, yet Spanish is a gendered language and thus ChatGPT provides male and female forks of the word "non-binary".
In Spanish, everything is gendered, usually descenable by an -a or -o ending.
So Spanish requires you to pick the male/female linguistic gender to refer to a person in order to say that their gender doesn't fit on the male/female binary.
I believe Spanish speakers just resolve it by using -o by default, because linguistic gender is not identical to social gender.
It's roughly like if English made you say "they're masculine-non-binary".
As a Spanish speaker the joke does make sense as is referring to how Spanish is usually spoken but it misses the detail that there's now the use of new gendered words.
Is really hard to explain in just a post but is a preview substantives in Spanish have a gender even things that you wouldn't consider gendered they have it it affects the use of the words and how you address people.
For example a simple word like "the" note that table is mesa and book es libro sona simple translation like
The table >becomes> La mesa
The book >becomes> El libro
The translates to La or El depending of the "gender" of the word. Is not that we consider every book male and every table female but we use gendered pronouns for objects and there is gendered words for everything that refers to a person. For example nurse translates to Enfermero or Enfermera depending if you talk about a msle or female person respectively, note the word ends in o or a now the troubles are if you're using plurals it will be Enfermeros and Enfermeras and the first refers to a group of people that can be all male or mixed male and female but the second refers to a group of people that is only composed of females and worse of all nonbinary people are not comprehended into any of this. You see the language is always throwing everything into male female bins even unwillingly and for a non gender conforming person that's hell. Now we could fill a book with how we are handling it but it has been tried to use the letter e returning to the nurse examples it will be Enfermere but the particle now is Le Enfermere and Les Enfermeres and now the second would be totally gender neutral and refers to a group of nurse people no matter the sex. But there's a truckload more nuances. General neutral and how we use it is an ongoing problem in Spanish that we haven't fixed it yet, and there's no general concensus Of where is going.
Imagine all the annoyances we'd solve if we made languages less gendered (including English)
Hi hello I'm your friendly neighborhood molecular biologist and I want to tell you (or anyone who might think like you) that you're totally fucken wrong lol
It is commonly accepted by contemporary biological scientists that sex exists on a spectrum. The technical definition of sex involves the size of gametes (in humans: sperm and egg cells) that are created by the organism, but we don't usually go around "unsexing" people who don't make gametes (the infertile, the elderly, etc.)
Instead we might look at chromosomes, genitalia, or secondary sex characteristics (beard, breasts, voice, etc.). Although the state of these characteristics often aligns (ie. XY usually means penis and more hair) they for sure definitely do not always.
You can have unusual chromosome combinations (XXY, XXX, etc.), you can have a modification of the signalling pathway for sex hormones (androgen insensitivity), you can have mutations in specific genes relating to secondary sex phenotypes (extra hair, no hair, voice changes, etc.). You might have a person whose gentalia say "female" but chromosomes say "male". You might get a person whose face, voice, and body says "female" but whose genitalia say "male".
You might think these things are too rare to bother with, but intersexuality (defined as a person who's sex can't be conventionally filtered into male or female) is estimated to be as common as 2% of the population (basically the same as red-headed people in the USA). Many people estimate that the actual incidence of unalignment between all sex characteristics as assigned gender is even more common if we expanded the definition to include internal brain structures relating to sexual and gender identity, or natural differences in hormone quantities that overlap between members of different sexes. Basically, science says non-binary is valid as fuck.
That's not even to get into the social construct of gender, but there's a whole scholarly discipline there as well. But I'm a biologist and people weirdly trust essentialist constructs of sex and gender more than social ones, so here I am.
a couple things here;
you care why?
you most literally can change the rules of language on the fly. that's kinda how language works and is created.
edit: removed the last comment as the previous guy was the one going on about sex first, regardless, differing levels of hormones can often influence this, considering males can have varying levels of estrogen and vice versa for females and testosterone. other animals often portray characteristics opposite that of their sex, as well.
this is just an odd thing for you to care about. why wouldn't you instead let people live their life without your criticism when they clearly are having trouble parsing their place in life and their understanding of themselves.
Jokes are not for everyone to laugh at and you don’t get to decide what’s a joke and what’s not. As you seem quite concerned if this is hate speech or not, let me reassure you : it’s not, I meant this as a joke. If you still want me to stop, feel free to block my account.
You gave away your stance when you assumed that the person that was just providing general factual information and context was somehow offended by your comment.
This implies that you believe your comment can be understood as offensive and that a logical response for an offended party is to… educate people with context.
“You guys”? Were all internet strangers here, free to act on our own accords. My personal opinions are mine alone.
All that one person did was copy some dry factual information of something i though you where have a misconception about. The fact that just reading a generic fact makes you think that someone got offended makes me think you where feeling threatened somehow.
If you have any logical reasoning why else you’d jump to that conclusion i am happy to hear it.
Till you do i keep my own conclusion which is that “woke” makes you feel upset and i need to balance an honest attempt at making you reflect on your own behavior versus hurting your fragile worldview.
I got the joke, but it's just not funny. It's overused so much I was fully expecting someone to say it as soon as I hit the comments. It's a part of the "only joke" series right leaning people make about non-binary people being "attach helicopters" and it comes up every time the subject comes up on the Internet.
Idk, I’m not from the US and don’t know what jokes you guys see on daily basis. Thing is, I couldn’t care less if you find that funny or not. What’s also funny is that the comment had +/- 10 upvotes and 0 downvotes till you guys came saying this is right leaning, trans hate and other utter crap. What was a simple joke (that you don’t find funny, I get it) is now labelled something way different. Gotta love this culture.
You didn’t understand, let me clarify for you : I don’t care if people find a joke good or not. None of my concern. I’m just reacting to people saying I’m using my comment against trans people. I really don’t know what’s up with those guys.
I agree that the joke went over their head, but I didn't read that as them being offended.
Joke? My take was that you made a foolish mistake and where rightfully corrected.
What was the funny part supposed to be? That the B stands for binary? Grow up 🙄
All i see is sentence that makes no sense however i read it and seemed to be confused about the meaning of b in lgbt+
Providing dictionary description as context is a great way to avoid misinformation because no matter how common knowledge may seem there are always people who have yet to learn.
Me responding to you stems purely from how you reacted to this person doing what is just a sensible normality. And not your failed attempt at humor though.
Do all jokes have to be factually correct ? Can you please provide some sort of notice so I can play joke the way it should be ?
Its often difficult to differentiate between serious and non serious on internet forums.
Something you can do is add /s to imply sarcasm so at minimum people understand that your not being serious. Humor remains subjective but at least you keep your dignity.
I legit read your “joke” like you where being serious and just that stupid.
