https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-68594153
Eye witnesses described panic and gunfire around the hospital in Gaza City after IDF troops moved in.
A war crime occurred when Hamas put a military installation in a civilian hospital.
Once that happened, attacking the hospital to get at the military base is not itself a war crime.
You might wish it was, but that's not what the law says.
That's assuming that that's actually happening. The article only gives the IDF's word, no evidence.
You demand evidence to prove that Israel didn't commit a war crime?
Proving guilt works the other way around.
I love this comment. Someone asking for proof that your claim is true, and instead you say they need to provide proof of what not having proof would prove. What? Israel is making the claim Hamas was there. The burden of proof is on them. If they can not prove it, then it's a war crime.
Regardless, Gaza is one of the most populated regions in the world. There isn't a place without civilians, and they aren't allowed outside of their open-air prison. They literally can not be any significant distance away from civilians. The "they're using civilians as human shields" excuse doesn't work when you force civilians to stand next to them when you drop exosives on both of them. Also, Israel has been literally using civilians as human shields, walking behind them as they force them to walk ahead.
That's how the International Criminal Justice (people who did Nuremberg btw) do things, yes, and by all counts Israel is an illegal, settler colonialist, war criminal, fascist state.
Fucking Zio scum
Hamas tolerates reporters, Israel murders them. I know which one I’m more compelled to take at face value when no better sources exist (because Israel murdered them).
Let’s go back on how Israel became Israel and their entire regime. Murder (of men, women and children) and displacing 750 000 Palestinian people. Apartheid, racism. Illegal settlements.
Lying to the world about almost everything and not to forget how they speak about Palestinian people (calling them rats, animals and so on). Also to mention they are saying to drop an atomic bomb on Palestinian people (Gaza).
But that’s all “okay”, right? In your eyes.
Not to forget, Hamas was only created in 1987 because of Israel’s action from 1948 up to 1987. That’s 39-40 years later.
EDIT: some corrections like “there” to “their”
No, that is a hoax. International law revolves around proportionality and civilian security, explicitly protecting civilian medical facilities and their medical personnel. They are not invalidated according to the crimes of the other side.
In fact, this would still be a war crime even if there was a nuclear silo under the hospital. You might wish it was, but that’s not what the law says.
Reference Geneva IV, Article 19.
Civilian hospitals can lose their protection if the sites are used for "acts harmful to the enemy."
"Losing protection" refers to the total overprotection granted by the above article, do not pretend that this grants carte blanche. The rest of international humanitarian law and other laws still apply, including the rest of the geneva convention.
That same article establishes clear limits of proportionality which they did not comply with, and even if they had complied they have violated so many others (have you read the news?). This attack is flagrantly illegal, and is one of the most moderate they have had against hospitals.
It's also a war crime that every Palestinian has a Hamas military installation in their body. Israel knows and is going to solve that problem. Better hope a Hamas military installation doesn't happen to you or Israel will be coming for you. /s
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Israel calls Khamaaas Nazi's on live TV but calling the people doing literal Genocide to create an ethnostate "Nazi's" is too far?
If anything this has been the most apt period of time in the last 75 years to invoke Godwins law.
Be semi-happy, at least its shows what kind of people the mods are. They approve Israeli’s hateful Shit but don’t approve the opposite.
Says much more about the mods themselves than about the other people.
It's a reflection of our society. Israel's government saying ISIS tier fundie shit about killing Palestinians (and actually doing it) is somehow considered normal because MSM said so. Any dissident or that calls out their war-crimes is "offensive and controversial".
We have to combat Genocide with a silver tongue. It's insanity.
A rap song praising genocide went #1 in Israel, it's not just their government that are bloodthirsty.
Anyone who has read my comments knows I don't approve of anything Israel has been doing, at least in my lifetime, and I've often compared their treatment of the Palestinians to the ghetto-ization of Jews in 1939.
https://www.nationalww2museum.org/war/articles/nazi-germany-and-establishment-ghettos
But as a group we do not allow slurs, even inventive new ones.
Feel free to criticize them, but not with slurs.
Alright, so I've got to push back on this. You "compared their treatment of the Palestinians to the ghetto-ization of Jews in 1939", which is explicitly an appeal to Nazi imagery. However, when someone uses a portmanteau to also say they do Nazi-like things that's too far? How is it OK to say they're like nazis when you do it, but not ok to say they're like nazis when this other person does it? Sure, they could have elaborated, but I don't think that's required at the moment.
Calling them Nazis is boring and reductive. Not only is it plainly NOT true, it deprives us of the ability to speak about what they are doing that is specifically horrible. I hear white supremacists and IDF members both called Nazis but I don't think those two groups would really get along that well. Let's look at some parallels between Nazi Germany and Israel:
Authoritarian Governance - Both regimes are characterized by strong central governments with little tolerance for dissenting views, often suppressing free speech and opposition movements.
Expansionist Policies - In the case of Nazi Germany, their expansionism was marked by aggressive territorial conquest and annexation. Likewise, Israel's policies towards Palestinians have been accused of being expansionist in nature, as they continue to build settlements in the occupied West Bank and East Jerusalem.
Ethnic Cleansing and Displacement - The Holocaust was the most notorious example of ethnic cleansing carried out by the Nazis against the Jewish population. Similarly, Zionist settlers forced around 750,000 Palestinians from their homes during the 1948 war that led to Israel's creation. Today, many Palestinians are still displaced and unable to return to their homeland due to Israeli policies.
Racial Purity - During Nazi rule, racial purity became a key tenet of the Third Reich's ideology. Jews were considered racially inferior and subjected to extreme measures like mass murder in order to preserve the Aryan race. In Israel, there is a longstanding emphasis on Jewishness as a requirement for full citizenship rights, while non-Jewish citizens, especially those of Arab or Palestinian descent, face discrimination and exclusion.
Control over Media and Education - Both regimes sought to control the dissemination of information through state-controlled media and propaganda. They also manipulated education systems to inculcate nationalistic values and a particular historical narrative.
I could go on, but isn't it nice to talk specifics instead of just lobbing insulting slurs back and forth?
Sure, it's reductive. I agree. I even alluded to that in my comment. However, it doesn't deprive us of discussing things further, as you just demonstrated. The fact of the matter is Israel is using many of the same behaviors they don't like Nazi Germany for using. I don't think every comment needs to list what they've done in order point out how they are behaving like Nazis. That would be very verbose very quickly without adding anything to anyone paying attention. We don't need to list what Nazi Germany did to say they're bad, and we equally don't every time Israel is criticized.
For the point of Nazis not getting along, that isn't unusual. Many Nazis were killed by Nazis. Some Nazi generals tried to assassinate Hitler. Saying they wouldn't get along with white supremacists isn't an argument against them being similar to Nazis.
Fucking shitstain power tripping mod, you know it didn't cross any lines and just couldn't stand to see someone post freely.
Just FYI, they referred to a nation('s government), not a people. Also, saying that they are behaving like nazis, how you did it, is also a slur. A slur is "an insulting or disparaging remark or innuendo", and it doesn't have to just be a one word thing.
I assume it'd be fine to call the Nazis Nazis, right? They represented the people of Germany, just as Israel represents the people of Israel. It isn't calling the German people anything, but it is pointing out a factual thing about the government.
That comment didn't say anything about Jews or anything else. It used a portmanteau to accuse the nation of Israel of doing the same thing Nazis did, which is literally what you did. A slur is a slur. Either it's sometimes OK, or it isn't ever. Your comment should also be removed if it's never acceptable, but we both know it is sometimes acceptable if it's disparaging by enlightening facts. If the truth hurts, that's on them. It's not anti-semitic or whatever to critique Israel.
Since when is it an insult to call people what they are? They are doing the nearly the same thing - if not the exact same thing.
Israel is doing:
Does these things ring a bell? I’m sure it does because the Nazis were doing the same thing.
There's an image which shows the very similarities between Nazis and Israel government. Certainly, I’m not allowed to show it because you will delete it.
Since when is it an insult to call people what they are?
It's perhaps not helpful. I can also come up with reasons why Palestinians could be called nazis. Literally the only difference is that they're not winning. So if Israel is 1939s nazis, Palestine is 1945s nazis.
But how does calling them nazis exactly help?
It’s perhaps not helpful. I can also come up with reasons why Palestinians could be called nazis. Literally the only difference is that they’re not winning. So if Israel is 1939s nazis, Palestine is 1945s nazis. But how does calling them nazis exactly help?
First of all you are currently calling all the Palestinian people Nazis and not just Hamas. Do realize the Palestinian people just want to live. They want to have rights, normal live circumstances, a home, a land and they want to be with their family. All of that the Israeli Government took away from them, brutally.
Claiming that the only difference between them is ‘’that they are not winning’’ is such an ignorant statement.
So Israel became an actual state in 1948 by displacing 750 000 Palestinian people and murdering many (men, women and children). Laying sieges, bombarding village and population centers, setting fires to homes, properties and good. Planting mines among the rubble to prevent any of the expelled people from returning (source: The Ethnic Cleansing of Palestine by ilan Pappé).
Now Hamas did not exist until 1987, they became an actual group only in 1987 because of all the actions Israel had done from 1948 up until 1987. Which is approximately 39-40 years after what Israel had done to the Palestinian people.
Racism, Apartheid, illegal settlements, unfair laws for the Palestinian people and sending people to jail/ prison for the smallest thing or no reason at all. Beating Palestinian people for no reason or provoking the Palestinian people to beat them. It got worse by the day, week, months, years and decades.
From this we can also conclude that Hamas did not start this but Israel did and that Hamas is fighting back. Just like the Nazis started the war and The Resistance were fighting back.
They (Hamas) started out by truly just wanting their homeland, homes and rights back. Israel did not allow it and went in brutal. You know what they say right? ‘’If peaceful revolution is not allowed, violent revolution is inevitable’’.
Israel did not allow it and thus Hamas started to get more violent and violent. Obviously they would, right? Everyone would fight for their rights.
Calling Hamas or Palestinian people ‘’Nazis’’ is like calling The Resistance from WW2 the bad people. They are basically doing the same thing. Want their homeland and homes back, wanting to live in peace with actual human rights. Why calling The Resistance ‘’Freedom fighters’’ but Hamas ‘’Nazis’’?
There’s also the mere fact if Israel did not stole the land in 1948, displaced 750 000, murdered many of the Palestinian people – Hamas would not even exist in today’s era.
Also realize that the majority of the Palestinians in Gaza are women and children. They are not men that want to ‘’erase’’ Israeli people, they just want to live. However with what Israel is doing, you can be certain hatred will grow within the Palestinian children and for that is only Israel to blame.
I would like to know why you would call the Palestinian people ‘’Nazis’’ and not just Hamas but I do also like to know why you would call Hamas ‘’Nazis’’. Because the only reason Hamas has grown such an immense hatred towards the Israeli people is because what Israel has done for over 75 years to them.
People often blame Hamas for the hatred and murdering on Israeli people but forget that if Israel never done these things, Hamas would not have existed nor would’ve done these things.
Hypothetical question to you: What would you have done if a group of people came to your house, murdered some family members (if not all) and threw you in the bathroom for 10 years. You finally managed to escape and you see them?
If you decide to beat them up or perhaps even kill some of these people and suddenly you are considered the bad person, you are considered the ‘’insane’’ one. They are suddenly the victim and you are the bad one for doing such a thing.
This is a dumbed-down version of what’s currently happening.
I condemn both Israel and Hamas but, I do understand Hamas perspective. They want their land, homes and rights back. No matter the cost. The world presidents seem not to give a flying care and thus they will have to do everything to make people care.
How does it help calling the Israeli Government, Nazis? Simple because that's what they are. The tick on all the similarity boxes. By calling them out for it, some people will do research and find the similarities. Also it proves that, they turned into the exact ideology they hate.
EDIT: Had to change something because the format was not right.
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No, making and enforcing rules arbitrarily which was the reason many of us left reddit.
Although tbf I think these two communities balance each other out because the mods on lemmy.ml have their own set of stupid and arbitrary rules enforcement.
It's not arbitrary. Everything is outlined in the sidebar, not that the offenders ever actually READ the sidebar. But it is there.
Start a different instance or community.
That's the glory of federation, baby!
Sure would be nice instead of being forced to abandon a growing space, that the admins actually took their job of curbing activist mods.
But they never will, ever, anywhere.
Fuck mods, fuck admins, they are all power tripping assholes.
I mean, some of them are good sometimes.
It just depends. I think the answer is to always have a way out. That way we're not beholden to any single group like we were with redshit.
Nope, sorry.
redshit
Lemmy is already as bad as reddit was in 2015, in a matter of 4 or 5 months. And the admins have done zero to curb mod abuse and the mods are just as arbitrary and thin skinned.
Because mods suck everywhere, no there are no good ones.
Never once have I seen mod abuse resolved in favor of the user and I have been using the internet a FUCKTONNE longer than any of you, I guarantee it.
Is the mantra of Israel "All publicity is good publicity"? They make headlines every day with war crimes destroying their own reputation rather than Hamas.
How's any of it bad though? They're getting cheered on by a significant number of people for the genocide.
Because the Middle East has oil, and the US insists on controlling it, despite being on the other side of the world. Israel is effectively a US colony that can be used as a reliable forward base for the US to fuck up the entire Middle East.
Don't just chalk this up to oil. This has far more to do with AIPAC, one of the most powerful lobbying groups in the US, second only to AARP with its >35 million members.
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I'd be cool with just pulling all support from them.
Let them fight their own battles instead of bringing the rest of the world down with them. 9/11 literally happened because the US supports Israel, but we still haven't learned our lesson.
Israel has nukes. And given their zeal with murdering civilians, it wouldn't be off the table for them to threaten them if anyone invaded.
Increasingly there is no difference between Israel and US police officers. "I feared for my life against a 12 year old so I shot them" vs "Hamas is in the hospital so we destroyed the hospital".
It truly says something about someone's lack of humanity when they attack a hospital. At least evacuate everyone first to another hospital.
It's not a coincidence. For instance there's the GILEE program which is literally a Georgia to Israel police exchange/training program.
NSFL (death+gore) some images of the aftermath
Isn't it funny how israel claimed to have full control of the north of Gaza but Hamas magically pops up in a hospital in northern Gaza to "plan attacks"
Oh my fucking god. These are rough.
This is what the people need to see. Fuck anyone who tries to censor it to protect people's "feelings."
Perhaps looking at pictures like this has broken my brain, but the first image looks 100% staged to me.
Looks like he got hit by shrapnel but not sure. If anything it was a very mild image. Occasionally people post images from older wars and claim they were from now but they don't stage any photos in Gaza. That was israeli propaganda using a behind the scenes clip from a Lebanese movie
If you want something more extreme here's a clip from three days ago:
NSFL:(gore+death): https://twitter.com/DrMadsGilbert/status/1769071393042202871
NSFL:(gore+death): Backup link;
If you know they're going to try to kill you no matter how cooperative you are, why the fuck wouldn't you be armed?
If you mention the second amendment it short circuits their little Israeli brains, they know their own miserable lives depend on a freedom denied to Palestine and that karma is real and terrifying.
There is a difference between US second ammendment gun nuts and living/working in an active warzone/genocide.